Have I purchased Fake watches from eBay? Probably I hear everyone shout!!!

Hi

Self confessed newbie and potential noodle - happy for harsh comments to ensue because I probably deserve them!!!

I purchased an Oris Williams F1 from this forum 10 odd years ago and absolutely love it. Not everyone's cup of tea but I like it and wear it a lot. I fancied a more vintage watch, so thought rather than go down the Omega or Heuer route I'd look at Oris. Didn't want to spend a fortune, so looked on eBay. I was somewhat dazzled by the following 2 watches so bidded and won them both

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/116099441419
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/116099411895

Again, appreciate they are certainly not everyones cup of tea but I like unusual things and colours, and thought on the right Nato strap they might look different and good.

When I received them they seemed too good - like new in fact, and very lightweight. The edges of the case are very very sharp, and overall leads me to believe they are indeed fake. I suspect the only thing that might have a slight chance at being original are the dials, but even then I'm doubtful.

I should have returned them straight away, but life got in the way and now it's past the 30 day return period. I notice the seller is selling more Oris watches, and I've contacted him saying I suspect they may be fake. Whilst I'm not saying he is knowingly selling fake watches, he may be totally innocent in thinking he has a supply of real Oris watches (which he might if I'm wrong and they are real).

Appreciate it is very very difficult to tell from pictures, but what are peoples opinions?? I can open up the case backs if it helps.

Serves you right for being a speedposter.

My eyes won't shift from that lume plot on the hour hand. Surely that can't be right?

I don't know about Oris watches at all. I can see how you would be attracted by this one - it's a cheeky little thing.

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Originally Posted by unclealec

Serves you right for being a speedposter.

My eyes won't shift from that lume plot on the hour hand. Surely that can't be right?

I don't know about Oris watches at all. I can see how you would be attracted by this one - it's a cheeky little thing.

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I was a member of the forum many many moons ago, but fell out of love with watches, and I think there was some sort of forum reset where I lost all my post count. Not a massive problem until I started to fall back in love with watches and fancied a new purchase. Apologies if it's offended, it wasn't the intention.

The pictures make them look better than they really are. If they were slightly larger in size then perhaps they might look better. I'm just intrigued in knowing if they are fake or not. I would hate to call someone out by saying they are potentially fake when they are real.

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Originally Posted by j90rdn

I was a member of the forum many many moons ago, but fell out of love with watches, and I think there was some sort of forum reset where I lost all my post count. Not a massive problem until I started to fall back in love with watches and fancied a new purchase. Apologies if it's offended, it wasn't the intention.

The pictures make them look better than they really are. If they were slightly larger in size then perhaps they might look better. I'm just intrigued in knowing if they are fake or not. I would hate to call someone out by saying they are potentially fake when they are real.

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Unclealec was not having a go, he has a dry sense of humor and I am sure he was just teasing :) as you are far from a speed poster.

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Originally Posted by Arcam

Unclealec was not having a go, he has a dry sense of humor and I am sure he was just teasing :) as you are far from a speed poster.

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LOL, thanks. Certainly no offence taken. Appreciate I'm reborn on here and I'm thick skinned enough to take the heat, especially if I've purchased some lemons ;-)

With eBay, you have ninety days to return an item so as long as you didn’t buy them over three months ago you should be ok.

Also, if you advise eBay that the items are fake, I believe they refund you and ask you to destroy them. But don’t quote me on that.

Edit : I’ve just had a look at the watches and, at the prices you paid, there’s no way they’re genuine and there’s no way the seller doesn’t know that.

Report him to eBay.

I think unclealec was being the epitome of irony regarding your posts vs. time here ratio, LMAO.

There's some wonderfully priced Oris pieces out there right now. HandT have a bit of a sale on, online.

There was a Williams one on there, which has now gone, only thist last month for about £500. But I don't know your budget.


Interesting to see if what Dave says is true.. a refund and a 'destroy'. If they ARE fake. Do you have to send them photos of yourself butchering one with a hammer, and the end result.. or do they take your word for it as you sport it on your wrist after you get your money back?


I can't help with authenticity.. sorry.
(Definitely seem fake looking at them right now).

They look fake to me,but if depends if your happy with them considering the price.

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Originally Posted by j90rdn

I should have returned them straight away, but life got in the way and now it's past the 30 day return period.

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Does the time limit apply for fake / counterfeit?

Surely that's a different kettle of fish, not allowing you to contest would see eBay siding with the counterfeit sale.

Just a thought... but I have no idea of the nuances of eBay.

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Originally Posted by Bonzodog

They look fake to me,but if depends if your happy with them considering the price.

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Yes appreciate in hindsight they are cheap, but I really don't want to be collecting fake watches and don't want to think I'm supporting that sort of behaviour. Have no problems if others are happy doing it, but it's not for me.

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Originally Posted by gregory

Does the time limit apply for fake / counterfeit?

Surely that's a different kettle of fish, not allowing you to contest would see eBay siding with the counterfeit sale.

Just a thought... but I have no idea of the nuances of eBay.

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Seller was originally stating he wouldn't refund as 30 days has elapsed, but as the conversation has moved on to me contacting eBay asking what I'd have to do if I suspected they are fake (i.e. what evidence would I need to collect and at who's cost) he's now saying he will accept a return. Thing is I'd just like some people more knowledgable than me to give me some comfort that I'm not being unreasonable in thinking they might be fake.

Fake.
If you still have right to return, do so. Raise a dispute with eBay citing them as fakes.
Some of his other watches are hideous.

At best Franken watches, with a few real bits perhaps, but most likely complete fakes. Return!

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Originally Posted by j90rdn

Seller was originally stating he wouldn't refund as 30 days has elapsed, but as the conversation has moved on to me contacting eBay asking what I'd have to do if I suspected they are fake (i.e. what evidence would I need to collect and at who's cost) he's now saying he will accept a return. Thing is I'd just like some people more knowledgable than me to give me some comfort that I'm not being unreasonable in thinking they might be fake.

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Personally I would engage pragmatism mode. If he is offering refunds, take him up on it. Let others put the Fake Watch World to rights.

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Originally Posted by j90rdn

Seller was originally stating he wouldn't refund as 30 days has elapsed, but as the conversation has moved on to me contacting eBay asking what I'd have to do if I suspected they are fake (i.e. what evidence would I need to collect and at who's cost) he's now saying he will accept a return. Thing is I'd just like some people more knowledgable than me to give me some comfort that I'm not being unreasonable in thinking they might be fake.

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You're not happy with them.

Send them back if he's offering to take them back.

Move on.

Nice and sunny here in the East of England today.

Thanks everyone - some sound advice and confirms what I believe in them being fake. Will take him up on the offer of a return and learn never to buy from eBay again and only purchase from this great forum.

I would say without a doubt in my mind that these are fakes - most likely an Oris painted dial on an old watch - Indian special.
Id take the seller up on return.

Raise a dispute through eBay and click the item not as described (because they are not). EBay will send you a tracked returns label which you should use for two reasons.

1) The seller foots the bill.

2) More importantly, you have tracking proof on eBay so the seller can’t claim they haven’t been returned. Once they are tracked as returned, the seller has a limited time to refund you before eBay intervene and refund you and charge the seller.

When something looks too good to be true, the seller seems to have had access to a few nearly new Oris looking at his feedback.

OP how did you buy a watch from this forum with so few posts?

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Originally Posted by adrianw

OP how did you buy a watch from this forum with so few posts?

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These were purchased from eBay, not this forum.

Those are undoubtedly fakes.

I think that seller is one that often sells Indian redials/fakes.

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Originally Posted by j90rdn

These were purchased from eBay, not this forum.

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I thought ihe said that he purchased an Oris from the forum ten years ago

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Originally Posted by adrianw

OP how did you buy a watch from this forum with so few posts?

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I'm not sure on the current situation but there was a time when you only needed 50 posts to view SC but (I think) 250 to post on SC.

Looking at the sellers full descriptions from his feedback he bought a lot of Otis watches at an auction,

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Originally Posted by Dave+63

With eBay, you have ninety days to return an item

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Originally Posted by Dave+63

Raise a dispute through eBay and click the item not as described (because they are not).

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I believe that the time limit for raising a Not As Described claim with eBay is 30 days - https://pages.ebay.co.uk/ebay-money-back-guarantee/#:~:text=If%20an%20item%20hasn't,an%20item%20hasn' t%20arrived.

If the item was purchased using PayPal, then they may have different time limits.

If the seller has now offered a refund, I'd take it, but would be concerned that - without an official case open - he might get the OP to send him the watches back but not actually refund the money. If he's willing to sell fake watches, I don't know how much I'd trust him financially.

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Originally Posted by adrianw

I thought ihe said that he purchased an Oris from the forum ten years ago

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Sorry, as I said right at the beginning of this post

I was a member of the forum many many moons ago, but fell out of love with watches, and I think there was some sort of forum reset where I lost all my post count. Not a massive problem until I started to fall back in love with watches and fancied a new purchase.

Definitely fake. The seller is also selling Fortis and Oris "Mickey Mouse" (both figuratively, and literally) watches with the same dial, albeit different names on them?!

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/116171346769
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/116168663383

Search for HMT on ebay, and you will see the same case used on the faked indian HMT watches.

I remember these doing the rounds a couple of years ago. Totally fake I’m afraid.

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Originally Posted by Dave+63

Raise a dispute through eBay and click the item not as described (because they are not). EBay will send you a tracked returns label which you should use for two reasons.

1) The seller foots the bill.

2) More importantly, you have tracking proof on eBay so the seller can’t claim they haven’t been returned. Once they are tracked as returned, the seller has a limited time to refund you before eBay intervene and refund you and charge the seller.

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Very good advice. A fake seller can't be trusted so best to follow the system to the letter and ensure the seller picks up the postage cost both ways.

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Originally Posted by Dave+63

Also, if you advise eBay that the items are fake, I believe they refund you and ask you to destroy them. But don’t quote me on that.

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No chance, unless eBay is footing the bill directly and the seller is not involved, that they'd advise you to destroy the sellers property.

100% Indian-made fakes - the least convincing of all fakes, and inevitably "17 jewels" for some reason, like a badge of dishonour.

Lodge a complaint with Thiefbay, and then for your penance, report every single similar watch from that seller as a fake.

Mumbai special.

Just looked at them. Very much Indian specials.

Thanks again everyone. I've emailed the seller saying I'll be raising 2x returns stating "not as described". To be fair he seems at face value to be a stand-up guy, and he may be as much a victim as me in all this. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and the opportunity to put things right. Fingers crossed.

Either way, it's a valuable lesson learnt. Every days a school day!!

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Originally Posted by j90rdn

Thanks again everyone. I've emailed the seller saying I'll be raising 2x returns stating "not as described". To be fair he seems at face value to be a stand-up guy, and he may be as much a victim as me in all this. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and the opportunity to put things right. Fingers crossed.

Either way, it's a valuable lesson learnt. Every days a school day!!

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He is not a stand-up-guy. He makes a living deceiving people by selling them fake watches. He is appeasing you with an easy refund so you don’t bring the whole house of cards down.

^^ Spot on. Looking at the sellers feedback, he has been offering them for quite some time. He absolutely knows they are not genuine.

Yes you could be right. People always tell me I try and see the good in everyone :-(

They are definitely Indian made fake junk.

The seller will know exactly what he's selling and the seller's job lot BS comment is a typical one.

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Originally Posted by MakeColdplayHistory

I'm not sure on the current situation but there was a time when you only needed 50 posts to view SC but (I think) 250 to post on SC.

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That sounds about right if memory serves me right.

Not a lot to access, but plenty to sell.

I think.

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Originally Posted by j111dja

They are definitely Indian made fake junk.

The seller will know exactly what he's selling and the seller's job lot BS comment is a typical one.

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I agree totally. I fell into the same trap once, but at a watch fair in Uxbridge.

A big lesson learnt.

At least now he knows his inventory is made-up of fake imported shite. Meaning he now has time to remove all the offending items giving himself less to "put right" with other unsuspecting buyers down the line.
I'd be tempted to send him a message to that effect (very tongue in cheek of course) suggesting that taking such a step might save him from two very negative feedbacks and reporting for selling counterfeit goods.
I absolutely despise these sellers, it's been common on ebay for ages and they simply plead ignorance when caught.

I'd be disappointed if that yellow one fell out of a Christmas cracker when I pulled it - utter JUNK !

Distance selling rules mean you can just change your mind if you want, and return them.

Like Nike says "Just Do It !"

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Originally Posted by j90rdn

Thanks again everyone. I've emailed the seller saying I'll be raising 2x returns stating "not as described". To be fair he seems at face value to be a stand-up guy, and he may be as much a victim as me in all this. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt and the opportunity to put things right. Fingers crossed.

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By all means, do use the eBay system to give him the opportunity to put things right with you, but....

He's knows what he's selling.

He is bringing these in from India and he knows they are fake (in as much as they have a manufacturer's name on the dial who has never seen the watches). Similar happens with Seiko a lot, although in many cases they'll be frankens. I sometimes wonder about the metaphysical question of when is a watch a fake or a franken. In any case (pun not intended), these are not what they purport to be.

Personally I wouldn't really have much trouble with it as the watches can be competently put together (albeit certainly not in all cases!). I think they would fetch similar prices even if they had "Mumbai Workshop" on the dial. Maybe even more.

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Originally Posted by adrianw

I thought ihe said that he purchased an Oris from the forum ten years ago

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Before the glitch.

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Originally Posted by Reeny

Search for HMT on ebay, and you will see the same case used on the faked indian HMT watches.

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This was my thought too. First thing that sprang to mind when I saw the pictures.


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