Guitars.. Where to start..

[MattH]

Afternoon,

So I know there's a lot of players (and collectors) of guitars on the forum..

Here's my query... If I wanted to learn with a electric guitar.. What's a recommended buy ? I have seen there are various styles and then there's the clones from various companies..

Ideally I would like to get something decent though not wallet busting in case nothing comes of the latest hair brained scheme...

Any suggestions or advice ?

Cheers

Matt

[GRK]

Hi Matt,

A couple of my daughters friends have just started learning and their tutor pointed them at a Yamaha Pacifica, which is available in a number of finishes, looks a bit like a Fender Strat, and sells for around £160; seems to be a good reliable starter option.

I suspect it's a bit like watches, a basic good value Seiko 5 tells the same time as well as a high end automatic but basic function is only part of the story you also have to consider looks, feel, image and all the other important subjective stuff.

I've seen some members here post pictures of some incredible looking instruments therefore I'm sure they will be along shortly to advise you how to spend more than you ever thought possible on a piece of wood :lol:

A couple of years ago I bought a £300, mid life crises, Japanese made, Fender Stratocaster which I play around with from time to time but I still wish I had gone for that £3,000 Gibson Les Paul and a classic valve amp 8)

One thing to think about is that if you buy a really nice piece of kit you will probably want to pick it up and practise more often.

have fun
grant

[brucelee]

The Yam is a good call. Carefull as there's a couple by the same name, one to get is around £160-£180.

[Taff]

A budget.. give us one of them to work to.. otherwise you'll be getting all sorts of crazy suggestions! What sort of music you want to play is also a good clue, and will change the kit signifcantly.

[Foggy]

Another vote for the Yamaha - should be versatile enough for most needs.

Make sure you get the guitar professionally set up too - rarely is a guitar, "out of the box", in tip top playable order.

I'd also advise you make sure you budget for a few lessons in the basics, too. Bad habits, with regard to technique, are very hard to get out of - I speak from experience :(

Cheers

Foggy

[MattH]

A budget.. give us one of them to work to.. otherwise you'll be getting all sorts of crazy suggestions! What sort of music you want to play is also a good clue, and will change the kit signifcantly.

Ermm.. well tbh I have no budget.. though for a change I was trying to find something decent but nor excessive especially as I am starting from scratch..

So Yamaha Pacifas are worth a look - what about the Epiphone Les Pauls (Which I believe are the cheaper versions ?)

As to music my tastes vary so I have to admit not having a specific style that I am aiming for - so sorry I realise that not much help and just vague :)

Thanks

Matt

[monogroover]

Afternoon,

So I know there's a lot of players (and collectors) of guitars on the forum..

Here's my query... If I wanted to learn with a electric guitar.. What's a recommended buy ? I have seen there are various styles and then there's the clones from various companies..

Ideally I would like to get something decent though not wallet busting in case nothing comes of the latest hair brained scheme...

Any suggestions or advice ?

It's a long time since I bought a guitar but these days you can get a very creditable instrument for a couple of hundred quid, or even less. A far cry from my first Les Paul copy, which was a rather nasty plank with awful pickups, terrible tuners and a plywood body. it cost £70 in 1976 which in 2011 money would get you a very decent guitar these days.

There are broadly speaking two rough types of electric guitar, one exemplified by Fender and the other by Gibson. The former type tends to have single coil pickups and a bolt-on neck, the latter tends to have humbucking pickups and a glued-in neck. There are hybrid designs as well, of course.

I recommend a Fender-style guitar to start on - they can be a bit harder to play but they will bring more out of the player. They are more versatile, as well.

[mrteatime]

squire strats are a good start.....i wouldn't go with a les paul type, there heavier and the necks tend to have a wider profile and are 'fatter'. the strat is a versatile and light guitar to play, and in my own very humble opinion are easier to play :D Plus i love the 'springy' clean sound of the single coil pickup at the neck :D

Others will agree and disagree, and guitars aren't a lot unlike watches, you'll find fans of single coil/humbuckers et al......and thats without going into amps :D

You could bypass all this and go for a variax guitar :D

http://uk.line6.com/variax/

which will give you the best of everything, although playing 'live' through one of these units seems to leave me a little cold....although for the beginner they will be awesome

and then playing through your pc/laptop to learn or practise you will have access to every sort of 'clssic' amp and guitar combi......from eddie van halens 'brown sound' to david gilmours awesomeness :D although it might take a few months to get there :D

whatever you decide to just remember to enjoy it.....you'll be suprised how quickly you pick it up....within a few minutes you be doing some barr chords and scissor kicking around your front room :D

[hlovett]

Thumbs up for a Yam! But if you are just starting out avoid anything like ibanez or jackson at the lower end of the market especially if they have a floyd rose style tremelo..Tuning issues and constant fiddling when all you want to do is play and this can take the fun out of it. Epiphone Les Pauls can be good. But the best advice is go and pick a few up at a local music shop and see what you feel comfortable with. Remember that you can look at 2 of exactly the same model but they could feel entirely different. Yamaha, Epiphone Les Paul or SG!!! You'll be crankin out Back in Black in no time!!!

Good Luck

[MattH]

Cheers all... Sounds like I have some research to do :)

Would anyone recommend a semi acoustic... Would that give the best of both worlds...

Also any good online resources you may have used in the past to get me started ??

Thanks

Matt

[Newbear]

IMHO a Yamaha Pacifica is the best buy. They have consistent build quality and are a lot of guitar for the money.

But my key tip whatever you buy is to find a local guitar dude and get the new guitar properly 'set up'. This is essential to the playability of the instrument, its ability to stay in tune and the intonation being correct (i.e. being in tune at the top of the fretboard as well as at the bottom - this is a delicate compromise that someone knowledgable about guitars will be able to do) - and a lot of other stuff as well.

Guitar shops should do this before they sell an instrument but most don't bother with entry level instruments. Often they sell guitars that are not properly set up and hence difficult to play for a beginner - or in some cases virtually impossible to any kind of player. In my view it is one of the main reasons that so many starting out players give up.

My second tip is buy one of these:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0857 ... ERF0VA7N19

I know Paul and he is an expert guitar technician - as a well as an all-round good guy and excellent player to boot. His book will tell you all the stuff the guitar shops forget to mention about keeping your guitar in goos working order.

Good luck with your guitar adventure!

[Taff]

Totally depends what sort of stuff you want to play. For pure learning and pick up and play 'ness', you can't beat getting a Yamaha acoustic and a few lessons. That will at least give you something to be going on with, while you decide which sound camp you fall into (gibson Vs Fender, single coil Vs Humbuckers - broadly speaking!)

[LuBee]

Had a fair few guitars in my time probably somewhere around 30+, all styles, prices and makes. Collection is down to 7 at the mo 6 electrics and an acoustic. I love guitars like you guys like watches :)

The two big brands you'll probably have heard of and recognise the shape of are Fender (Strat and Tele), Squire is their budget range and Gibson (Les Paul and SG), ditto with Epiphone. But there are other brands out there that are good, Yamaha's have been mentioned, good build quality (I've had 5 with no complaints), PRS and their SE range. I'm a big fan of Tokai - they do great clones of both Fender and Gibsons guitars.

Have you got a guitar playing mate you could take along to your local guitar shop to try a few? Its not just the looks of a guitar, they sound different too dependent on what pickups are in it.

I'm the opposite of Mrteatime and prefer the flat/wider Gibson neck profile and a pair of meaty humbuckers, I find them easier to play but everyone to their own :)

As somebody already mentioned make sure you allow in the budget for a setup (£40-50), it will help your playing no end. Most guitars are manufactured overseas and need tweaking, this includes the very expensive ones! I'm lucky I have a friend who has been a guitar tech for 40 years to sort mine :)

I think £300 will get you a fairly decent guitar these days. I personally wouldn't go less than £200.

LuBee

[will852]

I can only echo what others have said already really.

I've heard lots of great things about the Yamaha pacifica. However, I've also heard they tend to have a poor set up out of the box. A poor set up being exactly what Newbear said.

Squire strat's are always a good starting point, although a little boring. However, Squire are licensed by Fender so you know you'll be getting a good quality bit of kit.

Good places to have a look are the websites of Guitar shops that specialise in second hand guitars. This way you'll get a lot more bang for your buck and you could find something really cool or interesting that will encourage you to play more. You can also browse according to your budget a lot easier too.

[LuBee]

Cheers all... Sounds like I have some research to do :)

Would anyone recommend a semi acoustic... Would that give the best of both worlds...

Also any good online resources you may have used in the past to get me started ??

Thanks

Matt

What do you mean by semi acoustic? Are you thinking electric but semi hollow (335 type) or acoustic with onboard electrics?

If its the former these are nothing like an acoustic, they'll still need an amp.

LuBee

[Newbear]

Totally depends what sort of stuff you want to play. For pure learning and pick up and play 'ness', you can't beat getting a Yamaha acoustic and a few lessons. That will at least give you something to be going on with, while you decide which sound camp you fall into (gibson Vs Fender, single coil Vs Humbuckers - broadly speaking!)

Yep, there's a lot in what you say.

Lessons to set you off are a very good idea and there's no reason to start on an electric at all.

[MattH]

Cheers all... Sounds like I have some research to do :)

Would anyone recommend a semi acoustic... Would that give the best of both worlds...

Also any good online resources you may have used in the past to get me started ??

Thanks

Matt

What do you mean by semi acoustic? Are you thinking electric but semi hollow (335 type) or acoustic with onboard electrics?

If its the former these are nothing like an acoustic, they'll still need an amp.

LuBee

Ah. Yes it was the 335 style I had seen on a website :). .. See I truely know nothing !

[eldrich]

+1 for the Yam Pacifica, there are a few models from what I remember, when they were designed they were done properly and although they are fairly budget models they do play extremely well (I have a couple).

For the acoustic/electric Yamaha AXP are quite a reasonable buy as well, the AXP500 is the most reasonable I think. (Again I have a couple of the older models the AXP3 and AXP5) and find them to be rather nice

[Neil.C]

Personally I would buy the best you can afford. You will probably want to play it more.

After all we spend a fortune on stupid watches :wink: and you will get far more enjoyment out of a guitar.

Fender Mexican Strats or Tele's are very good and a second hand classic player (better quality with good pickups) for £350 would be my choice.

That said I like the feel of Gibsons, the shorter scale makes them slightly easier to play IMO and if you could run to a second hand LP Junior at around £450 you would love it.

Buying a good quality guitar second hand is a good plan IMO. If you get into the guitar you will appreciate the quality and if you don't you will always get your money back although they can get rather addictive like watches. I've got a Les Paul Standard arriving later in the week. :D

Good luck with whatever you choose. :)

[Groundrush]

I agree with Neil.C, buy the best you can afford. And while the Mexican Fenders are good, I think G&L Tribute series guitars are better for about the same money.

If you want a Les Paul and can't stretch to Gibson Money (a S/H Studio would be £500-750ish, S/H standards £1000+) you could look into Tokai, Burny, Greco, Edwards or if you can find one, an Orville (a Gibson made in Japan).

But the one piece of advice I would give is not to skimp on the amp. You don't need more than about 5W for home use and even that will have the neighbours complaining if you aren't careful, so don't go buying that 100W Marshall stack. Cheap options could be a Roland Cube which are generally well regarded, and I quite like Blackstar amps for the money but my all time favourite low power amp is the Cornford Harlequin.

You could get a S/H Gibson LP Studio and a Harlequin for about a grand and I don't think money can buy a better sound than that.

[Spencer Lee]

I too lean towards Gibson's. I've three guitars at the moment, A gibson SG standard at home, an Epiphone Dot Studio at work and a small traveller acoustic that flits between work, home and the tent. My amp at home is wonderful; a Vox AC4TV which i would highly recommend as it has variable output. By this i mean it can be a 4W when evryone (including neighbours) are out, 1W on an evening when everyone is milling around and 1/2W when everyone is in bed. It's a valve amp as well and you get some sweet tones out of it. Go for the AC4TV10 with the 10" speaker as this is the best speaker really.

http://www.voxamps.com/uk/modernclassic/ac4tv/

The only thing i would add is a headphone socket but really, it's not needed.

My recommendation is try before you buy. The more you play, the better idea you will have of what suits you. As has been said before, you buy a duffer. it'll sit gathering dust. Set yourself a budget and really divide it up, half to two thirds on a guitar, a quarter to a third on an amp and remember the other little bits, tuner, cables, plectrums of varying thickness's and, if you go for a Gibson/Epiphone type guitar get a case and not a gig bag! The reason for this is, if you drop a Gibson, you can break the headstock off. They are not fragile but Gibsons may not get away with some of the head knocks that Fenders will. I've never had any problems but i've heard of loads of people who put them in padded gig bags and prop them up somewhere, then knock them over.

Some people buy guitar stands. In my view, if it's not strapped on, it's in it's case. They are not toys and it's heartbreaking to buy a nice guitar stand, put your VERY expensive Gibson Les Paul 25/50th Anniversary model in it thinking it's afe. Go for a beer and come back to find the dog has knocked it over! Believe me, i speak from experience.

Also, if you try a guitar in a shop, then try to buy one unseen over the net, you may not get the same neck shape as the one you tried.

Try out both single coils and Humbuckers, they sound different and again, if you don't get the sound you want, you'll leave it alone.

Some cheap packages may sound attractive but remember, they are cheap for a reason. If you go to a decent guitar shop and expain to them that you are starting out, they will let you try different guitars and amps. There is no shame in being a beginner and it's in their interests to treat you right, there is a sale for them and after sales as well.

There are so many on-line resources around, you should'nt need to buy any books at first. Learn TAB (tablature) to get you started, it really is easy but, failing that, chord boxes will get you knocking out three and four chord songs within the first day or two.

Just remember IT'S FUN!!!

[MattH]

Thanks everyone.. lots to digest...

My only worry is spending a load and then losing interest later on... I have already tried to curtail the watch habit :)

I think around the 3-400 quid price range is my lot.. though second hand is always a option...

[Spencer Lee]

'Pre-loved' is always my preferred option. Some don't realise but many guitar shops have options other than new. For Instance, some, like GAK have New, pre-owned (secondhand), ex-demo and B-Stock. Make sure you have a look here as there are some bargains to be had, particularly if you are not bothered about some marks or slight damage.

Guitars are like watches in that, if you do your reasearch and buy wisely, there are some purchases that will not lose you a bundle if you decide to move it on.

With your budget, you could, for example, look at this Yamaha from GAK at £284 (there are cheaper but i line the Trans Black version of this with the Quilted maple top):

http://www.gak.co.uk/en/yamaha-pacifica ... rown/36285

Something out of the ordinary? This Michael Kelly Patriot looks the Mutts!

http://www.gak.co.uk/en/michael-kelly-p ... apor/29594

A little more expensive but who could'nt love a PRS at this price!

http://www.gak.co.uk/en/prs-se-singlecut-orange/17577

This Marshall MG10 practice amp. Yes, i know it's not a tube amp (the Vox i have cost me £120 but they are around £150 to £175 new, ideal if you can push the budget a bit) but it does have a headphone socket!

http://www.gak.co.uk/en/marshall-mg10/19471

Or, a little more expensive, this Line 6 Spider. I'm not one for amps with built in effects but i've heard good things about Line 6 stuff.

http://www.gak.co.uk/en/line-6-spider-iv-15/22286

Thats one example of a NEW rig under your budget. Again, second hand you could get more bang for your buck but i think this example is pretty good. And remember, this is only ONE shop!

[MattH]

Nope marks are not a problem.. just a solid bit of kit I can use...

Right off to check out some online resources to get me started anyhow :)

[LuBee]

Cheers all... Sounds like I have some research to do :)

Would anyone recommend a semi acoustic... Would that give the best of both worlds...

Also any good online resources you may have used in the past to get me started ??

Thanks

Matt

What do you mean by semi acoustic? Are you thinking electric but semi hollow (335 type) or acoustic with onboard electrics?

If its the former these are nothing like an acoustic, they'll still need an amp.

LuBee

Ah. Yes it was the 335 style I had seen on a website :). .. See I truely know nothing !

My favourite guitar is a Tokai 335 with Seymour Duncan Seth Lover Pickups, it was the first guitar that I bought myself and is the one I'd never ever sell.

Try one they're very versatile :)

[LuBee]

I agree with Neil.C, buy the best you can afford. And while the Mexican Fenders are good, I think G&L Tribute series guitars are better for about the same money.

If you want a Les Paul and can't stretch to Gibson Money (a S/H Studio would be £500-750ish, S/H standards £1000+) you could look into Tokai, Burny, Greco, Edwards or if you can find one, an Orville (a Gibson made in Japan).

But the one piece of advice I would give is not to skimp on the amp. You don't need more than about 5W for home use and even that will have the neighbours complaining if you aren't careful, so don't go buying that 100W Marshall stack. Cheap options could be a Roland Cube which are generally well regarded, and I quite like Blackstar amps for the money but my all time favourite low power amp is the Cornford Harlequin.

You could get a S/H Gibson LP Studio and a Harlequin for about a grand and I don't think money can buy a better sound than that.

Cornford Harlequin - my amp of choice :) cost me £350 s/h. Before that I went through Peavey, Ashdown, Epiphone Valve and a Matamp before arriving at the Cornford. It may only be 6 watts but boy can it rattle the windows!