Santa Cruz bikes, any experiences?

[NickMSM]

Having recently dusted my Kona Hoss down, I am now getting back into cycling (partly because my ankle is awaiting an op so I can't play football). I have always fancied a SC Chameleon, a friend had one years ago when we used to be into DH/Jumping and I really liked the look/finish. These days I mainly do XC, but I do like a good single track and some harder riding mixed in. Has anyone had a Chameleon, and if so what did you think? I gather they are pretty stiff, but I am wondering how they perform with a bias to XC set up? Some of the 2007-2009 bikes look like good value I think.

[MrBanks]

I used to have a Kona Hoss Dee Lux :D Great bike, I did hundreds of miles on it and even took it to the Alps one year. Sadly it got stolen from outside my apartment.
I've got a Santa Cruz Blut LT 2012, which I built with parts from my previous bike, a Commencal Meta 5.5 Carbon. The Blur is easily the best frame I have ever owned. The geometry is spot on for climbing and descending and it soaks up big hits with no problem. The reliability of Santa Cruz was another factor in my purchase.
I've not ridden a Chameleon, but based on my experiences I'd definitely go for a ride on one and no doubt you'll be smitten afterwards.

[tiny73]

Had a V-10 when I was racing DH and they are stunning bikes. If the Chamelon is the hardtail frame then my riding buddy had one as his commuter/play bike and swore by it. He only sold it as he's a new kit wh*re (aren't we all?) and regretted it for a long time...

[blackie]

I,ve still got my Bullit . Its a superb bike but a little heavy for what i need now.

[NickMSM]

Cheers, my Kona is the Dee Luxe, seems a good bike (I've had loads of Konas). However, due to owning so many Konas, part of me fancies a change - I intend on giving the Kona to my partner, and selling her Cinder Cone so she gets an upgrade too. The only thing that slightly concerns me with the Chameleon is the EBB system (eccentric bottom bracket), in theory it seems a decent idea but considering I wouldn't change to singlespeed I worry about the reliability of it.

This one looks gorgeous IMO:



- - - Updated - - -

I,ve still got my Bullit . Its a superb bike but a little heavy for what i need now.

Same friend had a Bullit too, I liked that but think it probably would be a bit heavy for mainly XC use.

[blackie]

I just got the Yeti but was also looking at an SC Butcher.

[NickMSM]

Yeti looks lovely. Think I would rather a hardtail at this stage, spent years riding full sus DH bikes and have enjoyed the purity of a hardtail recently.

[mickylall]

i have a santa cruz superlight and it's a great bike,fits me really well and can handle everything i need it to,which isn't much to be honest .
the chameleons are usually used for thrashing about and jumps so i'd be very careful about going second hand as most have had a pretty hard life but they are built to take it.the one in your picture looks like it's running an 8 speed alfine rear hub judging by the number of cables,great idea and supposed to work very - wouldn't mind a go with one sometime on my hardtail

cheers,mick

[blackie]

Yeti looks lovely. Think I would rather a hardtail at this stage, spent years riding full sus DH bikes and have enjoyed the purity of a hardtail recently.

The best hardtail i ever had was a GT Zaskar in Mango

[Acky]

I had a chameleon, speced up with full XT in a heavy cross country setting and on the whole a very nice bike, rides well and is renouned for versatility, from very very light weight cross country to jump bikes the chameleon can do it all, always looked great! Only down side for me was the horizontal drop outs, making it a little tricky when you get a puncture, but all in all not sure you can get a much better hardtail.

[NickMSM]

Cheers, looks like I'll have to find one then :) Don't want to spend a fortune, so might look for a c2008 model, can always upgrade the spec as I gather until this year the frame only had one change in 2007 I think.

[pastrana72]

A friend who I rode with, had a Santa Cruz Chameleon, it was a good frame but his was the older version , not the new one with the eccentric bb. I would not want that version after have a look at it in a LBS and not a fan of the horizontal dropouts on mountain bikes, I had a DMR trailstar with them once, it was a bit more of a hassle when you have a puncture or you are chucking the bike in the back of the car.

I really like hard tails, although I do have one FS bike (a Cove hustler), I tend to still prefer riding my hard tails for a quick blast.

I wanted the best hard tail frame that could handle everything well to replace my old dual slalom ali frame and So after a lot of searching I decided to get a cove stiffee fr, which is a amazing frame and ride. It is a aluminium frame and the hustler I have is the FS version of this frame which I got after a few years with the stiffee, as I liked the frame but fancied a bit of bounce to keep up with friends on the long fast desents and I am getting old ;).

I have always liked steel frame hard tails, so I got a Cove Handjob XC, which has a similar geometry to the Stiffee but rides a lot differently.

I have this frame built up as a fast Light trails and Xc bike to replace my old steel frame GT. It is very good frame.

The stiffee was and the hustler is built up as a free ride and DH bike.

If you are thinking of the frame only route, I would look at the cotic soul, I like them.

Also although I have never ridden one I do like a look at frames that Stanton do.

I hope this is of help. If you can find a older Santa Cruz, that would be cool.

[NickMSM]

Thanks for that, have been looking at the Cove/Cotic options too. As a rough guess, how much do people think it would cost me (excluding frame) to build up a nice XC machine? Don't mind a mixture of new/used, was hoping to build something for around £800-1000 tops, is this possible? I would quite like adjustable forks, lock out would be great but not vital. As I haven't been into the sport seriously for a while I have lost my way a little knowing what's good etc!

I may have found a nice 2011 Chameleon frame so just wondering if it's worth me building something up or buying something like the bike below if it's going to work out cheaper?

http://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/1253784/

http://www.pinkbike.com/buysell/1104577/

[Acky]

I've built up 4 bikes in my life from scratch and its an excellent experience as you get exactly what you want and the satisfaction of doing it! However it is always more expensive than buying off the shelf or second hand in my experience. A brand new bike in a shop always has courners cut, even top end bikes tend to have middle of the road bars/headset/seat posts etc. As with everything you pay for what you get, if budget is an issue I'd look to buy a solid second hand bike and upgrade bits I couldn't live with as and when.

[Crash7]

I had a Santa Cruz Heckler, which I abused, I weight 215lbs in kit and regularly dropped it 6ft to flat and 10ft to transitions in addition to thrashing it around the trail centres of Wales which included the odd up lift day.

I killed a Marzocchi fork, lots of bottom brackets, hubs, wheels, groupset etc but the frame remained the constant with no issues.

IMHO fantastic bikes and worth the money!

[stooo]

I have a Blur, it's far a more capable bike than I will ever be as a rider.

[NickMSM]

Thanks for the replies. Decided to go for a fully built bike, will hold off until I've bought my new car but I'll try to get one in time for the spring. Found a very nice Chameleon on Pinkbike, v tempting!

[bubi]

hey, i used to have a santa cruz skateboard.

the fish shaped hosoi deck.

[ism123]

I just got the Yeti

I also ride a Yeti (asr5) and love it. Am sure SC are in the same ball-park

[chrisparker]

I had a Santa Cruz Nomad for a few years and loved it. I would like another Santa Cruz when I can afford one, most likely a Blur LT.

[NickMSM]

Spanner in the works here, been offered a nice Cotic BFE frame at a good price. Does anyone have any experiences of these? The plus point is it's going to be cheaper than the Cruz, and doesn't have the ebb bottom bracket which some people complain about. The reviews seem good so I am very tempted to give it a go and build it up over the next month or two.

[stooo]

Spanner in the works here, been offered a nice Cotic BFE frame at a good price. Does anyone have any experiences of these? The plus point is it's going to be cheaper than the Cruz, and doesn't have the ebb bottom bracket which some people complain about. The reviews seem good so I am very tempted to give it a go and build it up over the next month or two.

I'd take the cotic. Easy peasy. Steel, no hateful ebb. British designed.

[NickMSM]

I'd take the cotic. Easy peasy. Steel, no hateful ebb. British designed.

Cheers, like what I am reading online so looks like a deal has been done and I'll collect it later :) Now to choose the components!

[stooo]

Chris King headset, Thomson seat post. Everything else is window dressing.

[NickMSM]

Seems those combos are almost industry standard now, are there any particular models so to speak that I should go for? From reading up it looks like a 120-140mm fork will be ideal, still deciding on what to go for but something with a lock out would be great for climbing. I've always had Hope brakes so will stick with those, just need to decide on rims. Need something strong but light-ish as this will mainly be an XC bike with a bit of singletrack/DH thrown in occasionally.

[warns74]

All depends on budget (as with everthing) but a set of Hope Pro II Evo hubs with Stans Crest rims would be spot on for what youre looking for and set you back about £300.

[pastrana72]

All depends on budget (as with everthing) but a set of Hope Pro II Evo hubs with Stans Crest rims would be spot on for what youre looking for and set you back about £300.

Good advice, decent wheels, I have a couple of pairs of hope hoops and have used hope for years. The only other hubs I have and rate are DT Swiss but hope are good for the money.

OP replied to your PM.

[NickMSM]

Cheers, will look into those further. Does anyone know if the Hope Tech X2's are any good? They seem fairly decent, but unsure if they'll be powerful enough for slightly more aggressive riding?

[warns74]

No personal experience of the X2's, but they seem well-regarded:

http://www.bikeradar.com/mtb/gear/ca...vo-x2-12-46006

Might be worth having a look at the new XT set up too?
http://www.bikeradar.com/mtb/gear/ca...brake-12-44702

Cheers, will look into those further. Does anyone know if the Hope Tech X2's are any good? They seem fairly decent, but unsure if they'll be powerful enough for slightly more aggressive riding?

[Captain Morgan]

Never had hopes but was never happy with the avid 3's on my giant so swaped them out for the xt 785's and more that happy with them

[NickMSM]

Thanks guys, got a good deal on some X2's so decided to go with them. They're more geared up for XC but suitable for light freeride use apparently so they ought to be good enough.

[NickMSM]

Finished the bike today, just been for a quick ten mile ride and I love it. Really responsive, chuckable and fun. Despite 150mm travel it actually climbs pretty well so does exactly what I wanted it to. Looking forward to getting more miles under my belt now

[stooo]

Looks great.

[liggy]

Looks like a job well done. Are they Rebas? If so what do you think of them?

[NickMSM]

Cheers, they're Sektor RL's, only done the 10 miles or so but initial impressions are good. Full spec is:

Medium Cotic BFe frame
Rockshox RL 150mm/20mm maxle
Thomson 70mm stem and seat post
Renthal Fatlite bars
Hope X2 brakes
Mavic 721 rims, dt swiss 36 spokes and Hope gunsmoke hubs
Hope gunsmoke headset, seat clamp & rear skewer
Maxxis 2.35 high rollers front & rear
Hope bottom bracket
SLX double/bash crankset with MRP carbon bash guard
SLX front mech (couldn't find a 9 speed XT annoyingly)
XT shifters/rear mech/cassette 2x9 speed

I may go for some extra bling with the cranks at some point but it's fine for what I want at the moment.

[pastrana72]

That looks a great spec and a really nice bike. My steel cove handjob ht is a similar build spec it is a great ride.

I hope you enjoy it, I think there is little better than building your own bike for satisfaction IMO.

[china]

I've been sponsored by the local importer at one point. Raced an Superlight and quite liked the bike. Have to say though, that the Rocky Mountains I had before the SL were better...

[NickMSM]

That looks a great spec and a really nice bike. My steel cove handjob ht is a similar build spec it is a great ride.

I hope you enjoy it, I think there is little better than building your own bike for satisfaction IMO.

Thanks, was good fun if a little stressful finding parts etc quickly. Also cost way more but at least I have something I really like :) Been out on it twice, thinking about adding a dropper post but apart from that it seems spot on.

[pastrana72]

I do not need to build another bike, but this thread has got me looking at cotic soul frames, cool 853 steel.

I do not know much about drop seat posts, that feature has passed me by never seen one.

Those maxxis tyres are great off road, but a bit like riding on Velcro on road. Still great tyres.

It always ends up more expensive when you are buying kit for a build as you start upgrading your spec. You have great solid kit on yours, nothing I would change.

[NickMSM]

Agree re tyres, although I might change to a slightly narrower one on the back as it doesn't seem to roll brilliantly. The Rockshox reverb posts look good, I had a look at one the other day and was impressed. A bit like auto wipers/lights on a car I suppose, if you don't have it you don't really need it but once you do, you wonder how you lived without. The Soul looks nice but I wanted something a bit burlier, wouldn't mind an ultra light Soul build for out and out XC maybe...

[pastrana72]

Those maxxis just do not seem to roll on the roads well, fantastic off road but tiring on road. I put some Bontrager XR Team issues on mine and the speed on road is amazing, low drag and fast rolling. Do not seem to please roadies as they pass you on the flat and you pass them on the hill. Not great off road.



then I use this,



I agree the BFe is a better all round burley option, I prefer that route than the light XC builds.