Reply With Quotevery informative (& scary) post
thank god i bought new
like you say you'd really have to know
anyone gonna report this to ebay?
did you ask to take the back off
I've been on the look-out for a DSSD as some of you know. I don't really like buying expensive items from eBay but there was one relatively local to me (This is the advert so you know what to avoid... http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ROLEX-DEEP...item3a7da7b1eb). I emailed them and the price they came back with sounded decent. It was a bit too decent though so my alarm bells were already ringing. I spoke to the person on the phone and she gave me the story of...
...we bought the watch in 2011, but it's a 2008 watch... Obviously I'm thinkiing "yeah whatever" so I quizzed her by asking "so did it sit around for three years in the shop??". She replied with "yes that's what we were lead to believe..."
Hmmm... then I asked the reason for sale and she said "...my husband had always wanted an Omega so he bought one at Christmas...". Hmmm.
Anyway, as my friend said he'd come with, I thought we may as well go and have a proper look. It was only 30 mins away and you wouldn't mess with my mate lol. So I went this evening and instantly had my doubts about the watch. It just seemed a bit too shiny and not as satin-looking as the GMTc I was wearing to compare. The bezel pip wasn't quite right, although not far off and the bezel got stuck half way round but then freed up the more I turned it!!! The case-back had a different metal. I know it's supposed to be Titanium but this felt more rubbery. It felt like something out of a school science lab so it was either a very poor grade of Ti or a completely different metal.
Then came the papers... Well the cards looked pretty bad and the print didn't look at all right.
I then started looking closely at the box... if you've owned a Rolex you'll know what a pain in the backside it is to remove the paperwork from the inner side of the top lid. There's a holder type thing you have to pull forward and then usually prize out the papers. The DSSD of course has a larger box, however, the flap just seemed way too flimsy and it didn't have the square holding blocks I'd expect to see.
I'd been told there was a receipt but this was just an A4 printout from a company called "Mayors" that were based in the Florida Mall. This is them...
http://www.mayors.com/en/static/vendors/aaron.htm
So of course I know this is a fake by now. 100% no doubt about it. At this point I then googled the serial number which was M660304 and it brought up several fake sites.
Finally, I asked the guy what Omega he bought in a friendly manner. Remember, he'd always wanted this Omega! He really stumbled at this bit lol. Literally he said "...it was one of those "seam, seamsters, seamasters is it?" (looking at his wife). She replied with "yeah you wanted a Gold one didn't you love". Well unless it's the 18k Planet Ocean, this guy is very lucky to have Omega produce a Solid Gold Seamaster for him lol.
At this point I just wanted to get out. I was dying to go on about it being a fake but didn't think it was worth the hassle. So I told them a story and got off back home.
I grabbed some pictures but didn't want to take too many as he, funnily enough, didn't seem to happy about it
Here's what I managed to take...
Honestly, if you weren't into watches, you'd so easily get scammed with the fakes now. They're 90% there and I just want this to be a warning to everyone. Tell any friends you know that are looking to buy a used Rolex.
Last edited by W44NNE; 27th January 2013 at 23:19.
very informative (& scary) post
thank god i bought new
like you say you'd really have to know
anyone gonna report this to ebay?
did you ask to take the back off
That is positively scary - it's easy to see how people can be fooled. In the thrid photo there seems to be a reflection around the date window which looks like there's a ridge or ripple in the dial around the edge of the window - a tell, maybe? Either way, it's clearly a minefield out there.
That's just my photo I think. It looked 99% as good as the real one really in terms of the dial. I just had to rush the pics so my fingerprints were all over the watch.Originally Posted by PreacherCain
That is positively scary - it's easy to see how people can be fooled. In the thrid photo there seems to be a reflection around the date window which looks like there's a ridge or ripple in the dial around the edge of the window - a tell, maybe? Either way, it's clearly a minefield out there.
The quality of some of these fakes is astounding. I know a guy with an AD and he has told me he's seen a couple of fake PAM's that he could tell apart from the real ones with out serious investigation.
Scary stuff for the bargain hunter.
1) Scary, indeed ...
2) I really like the fact that you take time and post a thorough walk-through of it all! ... and quite a funny story as well!
I'm not sure if anyone else has but for what it's worth I've now reported it.very informative (& scary) post
thank god i bought new
like you say you'd really have to know
anyone gonna report this to ebay?
did you ask to take the back off
Cheers W44NNE, an informative and thoroughly interesting read that should serve as a cautionary tale to us all, as PreacherCain said it really is a minefield out there and with 8 bids and 3 days left someone's going to get blown to smithereens!
Should report on eBay. I'm a noob out for something nice and stuff like this scares me!
Buy the seller again + too good to be true...it 99% always is.
What sort of house did they live in (cars outside)... ..? Was it a "rolex household" or council estate, or caravan site ? :)
scary, scary, scary
A lovely cottage with what looked like a 2011 range rover lol. Private plate though so I couldn't tell 100%. It was a family too... A son and daughter in their late teens. The son chirped in when I mentioned the box not having the square blocks... He said "the boxes are different for the deep sea...". They are, but they ain't THAT different lol.
Brave man, I wouldn't have went to a meeting with someone I thought was selling a fake and defo not wearing an expensive watch.
Several people were given the address and I didn't go alone. I viewed the house on street view before going and parked my car in a good position for a quick exit. It's done, there's no point in thinking like that and I hope the story helps people understand just how accurate the fakes are getting.
I was scammed with a PO once. Lets just say, I got my money back but it wasn't nice, and it seems that the Rolex fakes are now up to the standards of the ultimate Omega fakes.
Obviousely selling fakes is bringing in big money if he has a 2011 Range Rover, I wonder if he knows about the woman that was jailed the other week for doing the same thing!
It makes me think twice now about buying pre-owned from elsewhere. Good old TZ....
Seen a nice DSSD for just over 6k with B&P from jewellers in Manchester... Not bad price I think
should have asked for a glass of water and placed it in, after all it is a DSSD.sat back and waited for the bubbles.
depends on age and condition?.
I'm talking to a trader about a vintage Rolex, still looking. Anyway, he tells me that the fakes are becoming very clever (and understandably more popular), for example - real cases but with fake movements!!
Bloody nightmare out there for Rolex, I would never buy one now without having it first authenticated, or from a fellow TZ enthusiast :)
Good on you Wayne for posting this.
The one consolation is that this seller is asking for collection. Still it will require someone having the nous to spot the fake or hopefully asking for a trip to an AD for authentication to prevent a nasty shock.
Reported to eBay asking them to google the serial #.
David
Infinite Diversity in Infinite Combinations
More photos of this style of fake (I know it's another forum but ho hum)
http://www.rwg.bz/board/index.php?showtopic=37848
Scary stuff, I hope that in my time here I've picked up enough knowledge to spot a fake and enough wisdom to walk away if in doubt.
I M glad alls ok Wayne and you managed to spot it and the card looks all wrong , and like i say buy the seller buy the seller !! and if somethings too good to be true it usually is .
It was a good idea to have a look around first and take a mate ,but the scary thing is i hope you never took the money with you as the biggest of men can t fight a gun as that is like i ve repeatedly said all along is buy the seller as if its not as you expected or hoped or any issues you ll be refunded .
You're a brave man for doing that. Really scary how good fakes are now.
Nope, the money is safe in my bank account. I would have only paid via bank transfer if I was 110%. My Rolex was never mentioned and never appeared out of my sleeve. I actually meant to swap it for a Casio but got a bit lost and forgot to change it. I just hid it out of the way in the end.
Nicely as that would really have blown it ,cash stolen viewed a fake and got a Rolex (Genuine) stolen all in a days work eh not !!!
Well spotted Wayne.
When I was searching for the 1200 PloProf, I found one during a trip in Italy, the guy was a dealer, watch looked, felt OK...Nothing wrong with it. Than I noticed the lume was...slightly different than what the normal photos I've seen on forums. I passed on the deal and got PloProf from TZ member, very pleasant deal. After talking with watch specialist, I found out that there are some scary replicas of the new PloProf that are built with genuine parts and unless you open the double case back you can't know that it's fake. My wild guess is that the dealer had no idea that he had a fake watch.
I think in this case this DSSD was also built with genuine parts that makes is very hard to spot, my guess dial is the same and date wheel, hands...Things that will give you security when you see it and will look OK.
Hey Andronik, hope you're well :-) I'll catch up with you soon.
Yes, the Omegas were the most accurate ones I knew of until this evening. Don't get me wrong, I looked heavily into the DSSD this past week and that definitely helped me to spot the little details this evening, however seeing one for real was just scary. Quite astonishing in fact.
It wouldn't surprise me if it was also able to cope with at least some usage in water. It felt well built and the case back looked very well sealed. The crown screwed less smoothly than the real thing but it had a good amount of screw-travel. As much as the real one I'd say.
Did it have a pukka, working ratchet DSSD clasp?
Forgot to mention that. It ratcheted as the original does... Flip the clasp lock, use your nail to lift the adjustment section etc. it wasn't as crisp as a proper one, but it worked as its supposed to.
I really wish I could get hold of it and take proper pics. I know others have done this but they're all crappy pictures on phones or with flash.. Like mine above!
Interesting post, but come on. I know some people are terrible at listings items for sale, but who in their right mind would be so lazy/blasé with such an expensive item. As soon as i clicked the link it set alarm bells ringing. I'd have been thinking somethings not right just from the ebay advert
thanks for the tips. im pretty new to the country so its good to know such things happen!
Thanks for posting this as a warning to others.
The first word that came into my mind as I started reading this was 'scary'. I couldn't believe the number of times other posters used the same word. It sums it up really.
The sad fact is that some poor sod is going to part with his well earned money for that.
scooter
I know. Scary is definitely one word. I actually thought the padded cleaning cloth in the auction looked out of place, however a member on here confirmed that's correct. This is the level of detail the fakers go to now... A cleaning cloth!
I agree, scary! One of the best bits of advice I have got over the last few months is "buy the seller". So true.
Do you think the seller is actually aware it's a fake? I know it certainly seems they do from the sketchy answers. You should have asked to see the gold Seamaster! Maybe it was a Limited edition 1 of 1! :-)
Last edited by Mr Tetley; 23rd January 2013 at 22:39.
I agree, however buying the seller is only part of it. It's imperative that everything "feels" right... This applies to dealers in my book as well.
Not good at all - thanks for posting this. Glad I stick to vintage where I have a reasonable amount of knowledge. A modern one could probably fairly easily fool me.
Any chance that they don't know its a fake, or do you think they're definitely trying it on? It sounds like the latter from reading the bit about the Omega, but.....
Cheers
Foggy
I'd be amazed if they didn't know. With the story-telling, the fact that the jeweller on the receipt doesn't sell Rolex. None of it added up.
I'm sure you're right, I was just clutching at straws in the hope that they aren't crooks. Always trying to find the best in people.
The place from where the receipt appears to come from do sell pre-owned Rolex it would seem
http://www.mayors.com/en/featured/Wa...olex/g531-534/
Cheers
Foggy
i hadn't seen that. However the watch was as new. When I arrived, they'd laid it out on the table and it still had the tag around the bracelet. It looked as if it had never been worn... He said he'd worn it three times.
That would have been a great youtube videoshould have asked for a glass of water and placed it in, after all it is a DSSD.
“Don’t look back, you’re not heading that way.”
I've been doing a little bit of digging on Google (diggling I like to call it!) and it would seem that at one time or another there was a whole raft of these fake Rolex being peddled on Craigslist and the like with bogus receipts and warranty cards. I'm sure that the seller is aware that it's a fake but I can't help wondering if they're, in fact, the original "victim" in this sordid business and are now attempting to recoup their loss...
See here, a thread from TRF referencing fake Rolex with receipts from Mayors.
The dodgy serial number condemns it as a fake. But for the record Mayors do have Rolex branding on their website (and a link direct to Rolex.com).
Nick
Amended now
But there's a gold Seamaster de Ville pictured on this thread.....
http://forum.tz-uk.com/showthread.ph...atches!!/page2
ETA: don't know whether it's solid gold or plated, nor is the poster stating either way.
This is where I really enjoy the vintage pieces....this was my grandfather's daily wear:
Last edited by nickg; 23rd January 2013 at 23:22.
thats a very good story and thanks for sharing , im looking at getting a rolex ( pre owned ) and this freaks me out a bit :)
She said they ought a new gold Seamaster at Christmas time. Unless they travelled back in time, I don't think she meant that!
It was a swizz. Simple as that IMO. I'm glad some people are finding the thread useful :-)
Fascinating story Wayne.
As a die-hard non-ebay user this rancid story gives me a deal of self-satisfaction.
On the other hand I can't help think - perhaps naively - that there should be a law against ebay fakes (maybe there is), indeed that you should tell ebay, the police or even Rolex, because some honest person may potentially part with an amount of hard earned.
I completely agree with all the above but in all honesty, I don't want to get too involved for obvious reasons :-(
Phew ,close shave.Good post ,the thing that gets me is even the card looks ok to my untrained eye..spooky
Oh sorry - I misunderstood. Wasn't trying to imply that you were incorrect - just confused!!
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