Need help! My old watch turns out to be registered as stolen...!

[Daddelvirks]

I haven't the slightest clue anymore and I coudn't give toss about what the orinal purpose of this thread was, I'm just in it to keep it alive and into the Guiness Book of Records

Daddel.

[daveyw]

The bonkersness is strong on this thread....

[Josh B]

Chaps 20 seconds with Google will explain the idea of "good title" under UK law.
A further quick Google for CAB advice will tell you what is expected of you as a UK citizen who does not have "good title".
How this thread has gone on for so long is beyond me. The OP asked what he should do. That is a moral question to which he should already have known the answer.

And that was all resolved PDQ. Which is why the rest is just the bored regulars in the pub wittering on (including myself ofc.)

[PickleB]

Chaps 20 seconds with Google will explain the idea of "good title" under UK law.
A further quick Google for CAB advice will tell you what is expected of you as a UK citizen who does not have "good title".
How this thread has gone on for so long is beyond me. The OP asked what he should do. That is a moral question to which he should already have known the answer.

And what about Dutch law and Dutch citizens...have you looked that up too?

[matt109]

It is just an intellectual exercise for me. I am conversing in an environment that has little relevance or importance, social media and I don't take it seriously at all. If some people don't like what I say, in the words of someone or other, 'am I bothered!
Mitch

Trouble is I fear you are giving someone hope, where in reality there is none...

[Daddelvirks]

And what about Dutch law and Dutch citizens...have you looked that up too?

Yeah, they are all bonkers as well it stated.

Daddel.

[RobDad]

Just to say I love that, chuckling like a 13 year old with a copy if Viz!

[keitht]

Not having the will, nor I doubt the physical years left to read all this thread, I will try and summerise the content based on the snippets I have read.

Prologue. Mine

No!
Oh!

Ours!
Bugger.

gets a little confusing after that.

Ours!

Arrrrrgggghhhhh

Rolex

Enter protagonists

C**t
T**t
( some wrestling ensues )

You are!
No you are

Ha ha......trousers.

My are better.

Humph!

Epilogue

Alternative endings are possible though I expect one will consist of wearing the right atire and watch to successfully poo through one or more letterboxes.

[astonandy]

Not having the will, nor I doubt the physical years left to read all this thread, I will try and summerise the content based on the snippets I have read.

Prologue. Mine

No!
Oh!

Ours!
Bugger.

gets a little confusing after that.

Ours!

Arrrrrgggghhhhh

Rolex

Enter protagonists

C**t
T**t
( some wrestling ensues )

You are!
No you are

Ha ha......trousers.

My are better.

Humph!

Epilogue

Alternative endings are possible though I expect one will consist of wearing the right atire and watch to successfully poo through one or more letterboxes.

If this were Reddit, I would give you Gold for your excellent and perceptive summary. Have you considered a daily news round-up?

[andybaird22]

I've heard of keyboard gangsters but never keyboard lawyers! Funny how the most angry people on this thread arnt the guys who it is actually aboit

[hilly10]

I haven't the slightest clue anymore and I coudn't give toss about what the orinal purpose of this thread was, I'm just in it to keep it alive and into the Guiness Book of Records

Daddel.

You are about right with that Daddal since page 3 just a load of boring tosh.

[Captainhowdy]

It is just an intellectual exercise for me. I am conversing in an environment that has little relevance or importance, social media and I don't take it seriously at all. If some people don't like what I say, in the words of someone or other, 'am I bothered!



Mitch

Good luck with that, you appear to be working without the correct tools needed.

[Montello]

I would characterise much of what Josh B has written as Pseudolaw:

FTFY

What this thread highlights is that the law is only available to those with deep pockets (or who qualify for legal aid); Rolex have deep pockets and will do as they see fit.

I doubt Tris will see this watch again ... I doubt he has the funds to sue Rolex so we know what happens next ...

[GrandS]

9. Some forum members are pathetic. I mean you by the way.

10. Some forum members are brain dead twits. I mean you by the way.

[aldfort]

And what about Dutch law and Dutch citizens...have you looked that up too?

That took about 20 seconds as well. here is an interesting link for you. http://www.dutchcivillaw.com/content/legalsystem044.htm

[Captainhowdy]

10. Some forum members are brain dead twits. I mean you by the way.

11. Some trolls wish they had bought the Rolex, but sadly will never be able to, this in turn creates great amounts of envy and thread spoiling.

[Mitch]

Good luck with that, you appear to be working without the correct tools needed.

Another fatuous comment.

It seems that being fatuous is a particular attribute of yours. In case you don't know (Fatuous - ": silly, foolish, stupid, inane, nonsensical, childish, puerile, infantile, idiotic, brainless, mindless, vacuous, imbecilic, asinine, witless, empty-headed, hare-brained;")

Well done for letting us know!




Mitch

[PickleB]

That took about 20 seconds as well. here is an interesting link for you. http://www.dutchcivillaw.com/content/legalsystem044.htm

I trust you've read my post at #71 and will now be able to provide us with your summary conclusion as to current title issues etc as between UK, NE & DE legislations...thanks.

[learningtofly]

Mitch, take a step back, mate. It's just an internet forum, and those involved haven't come to you (or anyone else on here) for legal counsel so there's no reason to get heated. Matters will resolve themselves soon, I'm sure.

[Captainhowdy]

Another fatuous comment.

It seems that being fatuous is a particular attribute of yours. In case you don't know (Fatuous - ": silly, foolish, stupid, inane, nonsensical, childish, puerile, infantile, idiotic, brainless, mindless, vacuous, imbecilic, asinine, witless, empty-headed, hare-brained;")

Well done for letting us know!


Mitch

It might not surprise you to know that I've been called worse. But I can't help but wonder what line of work you do, please tell me what it is you do that gives you more of an insight to the workings of our UK legal system that our two qualified lawyers?

[GrandS]

11. Some trolls wish they had bought the Rolex, but sadly will never be able to, this in turn creates great amounts of envy and thread spoiling.

1. Nobody is really sure whether or not Rolex has the right to confiscate property.

2. The authorities in Germany are investigating and the watch will most likely be returned to the owner there.

3. Tris will be fully compensated.

4. JT will be left holding the can since it will probably be difficult for him to recover the funds he paid for the watch.

5. Rolex is not very generous when it comes to sharing information about stolen watches.

6. Rolex will adjust your clasp free of charge. However, you just might never see the watch again.

7. Don't buy a used high value watch unless you are able to ascertain its provenance and establish an indisputable title. Taking a trip with the seller to your friendly dealer and asking to have it checked would seem prudent.

8. Some forum members are not very polite.

Those are the facts. If you don't like them, then just shoot the messenger.

[mountmusic]

Interesting story on TRF at the moment: http://www.rolexforums.com/showthread.php?t=402312

In short, a member there came across his stolen SD being auctioned on ebay (the serial number was clearly displayed!). Seller has agreed to return the watch to the TRF member subject to police verification.

[Mitch]

Mitch, take a step back, mate. It's just an internet forum, and those involved haven't come to you (or anyone else on here) for legal counsel so there's no reason to get heated. Matters will resolve themselves soon, I'm sure.

I have never taken a step forward and I am perfectly cool with everything.

This is social media, it means next to nothing in the scheme of things. We are just spending time commenting on stuff presumably because we have nothing better to do at the moment.

You don't really believe I would advocate Tris or anyone else to take a particular course of action, based solely on the comments of some anonymous bloke on a social media site, do you?

The OP and Tris wanted our thoughts on the subject and I have given mine that's all.

Of course, as this is social media, you get people making fatuous comments but that says more about them than it does about the person they are aiming it at. if people have a dig at me out of the blue, I might reply in kind.

However, it is not important, it's an internet forum. how seriously do people take that?




Mitch

[prexelor]

OP/buyer/seller I hope you manage to get this resoluted, whether it is the watch back or your money.

[Daddelvirks]

Last update!!!

No use bringing Dutch law into it anymore I've just found out that our Advocaat (lawyer) is going to Sunderland (UK), and we are officially Lawless

Daddel.

[Captainhowdy]

1. Nobody is really sure whether or not Rolex has the right to confiscate property.

2. The authorities in Germany are investigating and the watch will most likely be returned to the owner there.

3. Tris will be fully compensated.

4. JT will be left holding the can since it will probably be difficult for him to recover the funds he paid for the watch.

5. Rolex is not very generous when it comes to sharing information about stolen watches.

6. Rolex will adjust your clasp free of charge. However, you just might never see the watch again.

7. Don't buy a used high value watch unless you are able to ascertain its provenance and establish an indisputable title. Taking a trip with the seller to your friendly dealer and asking to have it checked would seem prudent.

8. Some forum members are not very polite.

Those are the facts. If you don't like them, then just shoot the messenger.

Strangely there are very few facts in your post.

[seadog1408]

Strangely there are very few facts in your post.

thats what I thought!!!!

[Daddelvirks]

thats what I thought!!!!

You had a thought??!!!

Daddel.

[lawman_nl]

"Anyone care to summarise the outcome of the thread so far in ten words or less?"

The Dutch can have title to stolen goods, Brits don't.

This, I think. Tris may lose the watch and in that case I hope Jeroen will be able to reclaim his money from the guy he bought the watch from. In this case Dutch law probably wouldn't have protected Jeroen against recovery either.

Questioning the legality of Rolex holding the watch (in different law sytems) - morality was not the issue, I think - does of course not make one a "Rolex hater" like someone seemed to suggest. I think I would love to own a used 2-liner 14060M, but I'm not prepared to give up my Germans (Damasko DA36, Sinn EZM2 and Tutima DI300) and my Seiko mods plus a large sum of money for it.

Now, can we get this thread to 1,000 posts?

[RAJEN]

Can we let this thread lie dormant till any of the two parties has an update?

[Josh B]

Can we let this thread lie dormant till any of the two parties has an update?

No! I am looking forward to hearing about how arbitration in bilateral investment treaties and arrest of vessels in Mongolian admiralty law might inform the debate!

[Archduke]

No! I am looking forward to hearing about how arbitration in bilateral investment treaties and arrest of vessels in Mongolian admiralty law might inform the debate!

Quiet day at the office?

[flugzeit]

Tris may lose the watch and in that case I hope Jeroen will be able to reclaim his money from the guy he bought the watch from. In this case Dutch law probably wouldn't have protected Jeroen against recovery either.

At the end of the day, it is exactly comments like this to which many members here have been objecting. Jeroen repaying Tris has absolutely nothing to do with whether he, at any point, can reclaim any money from the previous owner of the watch. OK... Jeroen, after making other signals, has effectively said he would reimburse Tris for the full value. I could give a damn about the endless drivel about the law here. The moral obligation which this forum expects from Jeroen remains clear and unequivocal.

-flugzeit

[hilly10]

Can we let this thread lie dormant till any of the two parties has an update?

At last a sensible post. For gods sake let it go. Some of you are at each others throats, you would thing you have all been wronged, only the OP and Tris are set to lose out here. It will all come out in the wash, and then we will know weather Rolex were right to keep the watch, Dutch law or UK law prevailed. You lot have just gone round and round the houses for nigh on 15 pages. I wish Eddie would close the thread and just let the OP AND TRIS UPDATE WHENEVER.

[Buster73]

How much I'd like to help Tris, I simply can't refund him. I purchased the watch in good faith, which I can prove, and sold it to Tris, who bought it in good faith, as we both can prove. I'm not sure either of us is responsible in this situation.

I'm not trying to get out of this, but repaying Tris would mean I'd have to quit my study ... EDIT: lots of anger because of this statement. Let me clear this up. I get paid 8 euro's an hour. How long do you think it will take me to recover the 3000 euro. No worries, Tris and I are in good terms and will reach a solution. For now, we just have to wait and see what Rolex and the police say about the matter, and what happens next. This also involves the people further down the chain, the insurance company, the original owner, and so forth. We're in the dark now, let's clear things up first.

I'm actually doing everything iN my power to help Tris and the police, but this one is really out of my reasonable power.

You get paid €8 per hour , but you had enough cash to buy the watch in the first place.

What a strange statement to make , what happened to the cash raised from the sale ?

I cannot believe what I've just read , if you had bought the watch from him you'd expect reimbursement pdq, so double standards apply here.

Pay the man his money now with no further delay.

[Daddelvirks]

You get paid €8 per hour , but you had enough cash to buy the watch in the first place.

What a strange statement to make , what happened to the cash raised from the sale ?

I cannot believe what I've just read , if you had bought the watch from him you'd expect reimbursement pdq, so double standards apply here.

Pay the man his money now with no further delay.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH HHHHHHHHHRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGGGGGGGGHHH

I'm caught in a time loop.

Daddel.

[Kingstepper]

You get paid €8 per hour , but you had enough cash to buy the watch in the first place.

What a strange statement to make , what happened to the cash raised from the sale ?

I cannot believe what I've just read , if you had bought the watch from him you'd expect reimbursement pdq, so double standards apply here.

Pay the man his money now with no further delay.

Maybe he should wait and see what Rolex are going to do?

Etc.

[lawman_nl]

At the end of the day, it is exactly comments like this to which many members here have been objecting. Jeroen repaying Tris has absolutely nothing to do with whether he, at any point, can reclaim any money from the previous owner of the watch. OK... Jeroen, after making other signals, has effectively said he would reimburse Tris for the full value. I could give a damn about the endless drivel about the law here. The moral obligation which this forum expects from Jeroen remains clear and unequivocal.

-flugzeit

You're reading something in my comment I did not say or mean. Exactly because Jeroen said he would do the right thing, I am hoping he won't be the one that is left with the financial loss.

Now, since many Brits consider it to be bizarre that stolen ojects could be subject to a limitation of recovery, how about those Elgin Marbles in the British Museum... (just kidding, please don't attack me!).