Reply With QuoteMy attitude is that i don't think it is in the spirit of the forum to buy watches and sell on at a profit (dealing as you put it)Originally Posted by PhilipK
In my personal dictionary, those people are "dealers", not "flippers".
I've never quite understood this attitude. Apart from the whole discussion about where profiteering starts and end, I believe that it's up to the owner to ask whetever he want, full stop. Whether anybody chooses to buy at that price may be a very different matter.
This, for me, is the most bizarre attitude on SC. What other item do you buy, use for a period (whether it's a week or a year), and then expect to get back all the money that you paid for it?
My attitude is that i don't think it is in the spirit of the forum to buy watches and sell on at a profit (dealing as you put it)
I just want back what it owes me.
Are you thinking of the US guy on eBay who seems to sell a lot of 'boutique' watches? The only place he could be getting them is watch forums, WUS being a prime candidate.
Last edited by markrlondon; 23rd March 2015 at 06:56.
Last 2 watches I bought of SC about 2 years ago fell apart after a week both under £100.00 ended up in the bin, I found one at home so sold it on hear for about £60 quid, the buyer said it didn't work, it did before it left me, I refunded and told him to keep the watch.
It turned up on SC fully workingabout a 6 month's later, he bagged £80 quid for it, I bet he put nothing in the charity box.
It's not worth the hassle.
looking around I would say the prices are competitive, but not low. A few desirable brands will always have support but other more fashionable brands have less.
I think future watch values are very uncertain. More than 50% of youngsters today don't wear a watch so there's no aspiration to upgrade.
Myself and friends wore watches from Guess, Diesel, Fossil and Animal in our teens. In our 20's we wore Tags and Breitlings, now in our 30's we've got Omega, Rolex and Panerai. Teens now have a greater appreciation now for electronics rather than mechanics so whose going to be buying used Tissot and Oris in the future?
10-20 years ago investing in watches was a pretty safe bet. If I had a pot of cash to invest now it wouldn't be in watches, there's no telling the size of the marketing in 20 years time.
They're not "youngsters" forever – at some point they will mature, and like many of us, find watches to be somewhat interesting and appealing.
Not all collectors or hobbyists start out interested at a young age – for many it'll not be until much later in life.
That's not good. Did you post a villain thread?Last 2 watches I bought of SC about 2 years ago fell apart after a week both under £100.00 ended up in the bin, I found one at home so sold it on hear for about £60 quid, the buyer said it didn't work, it did before it left me, I refunded and told him to keep the watch.
It turned up on SC fully working
It's not worth the hassle.
I honestly, couldn't be arsed.
I just avoid it.
I'm not sure about that - Even within my own age group (40) I notice a lot more people saying "I don't wear a watch, why bother when i've got a smartphone?" - so a decent wearable might chop off both the head and tail.
Having said that, the growth in the Swiss market was mechanical last year and they account for the majority of the turnover, so you don't really need a (relatively) high volume of people to remain interested for the main players to stick around.
I wasn't that interested until a couple of years ago (now 40), and the same applies to a lot of my friends. For a lot of us it's not til later in life you start to appreciate watches- and I'm only just starting to learn! Before that it's tech, cars, motorbikes etc...
My experience is that things haven't changed too much. In the 40ish age group there are people who have always had the love and progressed their collections as the years've gone by and the attainability has changed. But I see younger people who currently have say a Boss, ask me my views on moving on to a Tag or Omega.
The likes of IWC being so prominent in F1 has also had a big impact that I've seen.
I've also noticed the prices of old Tudors rise massively as they reappeared in the Anglo-Saxon periphery (they've always been sold everywhere else) and have reached into the back catalogue, making the old watches appear relevant again.
I think used prices of watches have fallen most from brands which have markedly changed design direction in recent years. A new Superocean is the best part of £3k, while you can pick up a mint used one for around £1,000 (discounting expensive central London dealers who all want 50% more!). That's a difference of 3:1. Compare to Rolex, with basically the same designs year in, year out, at about 4:3 new:used.
...but what do I know; I don't even like watches!
I haven`t seen prices of vintage watches dropping; if anything the opposite is the case, with top examples fetching stronger prices.
In the longer term I can see prices falling due to the difficulty/expense in maintaining old watches. However, I could say the same about classic cars but the exact opposite has happened; prices are climbing despite the increased cost of maintenance and the decreasing number of owners who can wield a spanner.
Paul
Might have something to do with how long one has to wait before they can list a watch on TZ-UK's SC. Seems counter productive and perhaps should reflect the same number of posts required as it takes to even see the SC.
I find it very hard to justify the premium of the AD experience these days given discounts are non existent on many makes and models. I bought a mint 4 month old Rolex off the forum last week saving £1400 on the rrp. I was pleased to see that Rolex's new warranty card does not record the buyers name. Only a small matter but does help shrug off the 2nd hand feeling to a used watch purchase.
The lack of price increases in the last few years may have squashed the notion of a guaranteed profitable return previously expected of selling on a Rolex after a few years. At least with forum prices it seems a very good time to buy and not a good time to sell.
Last edited by mylofitz; 28th March 2015 at 19:05.
that's nice price so congrats.
When i was searching to buy another watch what amused me was attitude at AD. They did not even discussed any discounts as they probably know at the end they will sell it to some tourist or a person who doesn't care a lot. It is worth buying there if you want to hear many time "yes, sir" "that's fantastic watch sir", "we can do free-interest, sir" :)
Non existent discounts are a domain in the UK. You can get them easier in other EU countries. I cannot understand that looking at the fact how easy it is to buy/source watch from other country. I bought one of mine 25% off UK rrp, favorable exchange rate plus discount.
However, all those watches are too expensive for what they offer in return.
Can you spot her?
Last edited by KavKav; 28th March 2015 at 19:02.
Sorry, no. I have got her up to changing balances but she never quite gets them right, mainly due to her irritating habit of stopping mid-change to lick her arse!
Until I get her more focussed, I cannot really take on outside work for her, so hence no waiting list, sorry!
So top end has gone up, mid to low is down. I think that's what normally happens in a recession....
I'm a relatively newcomer to wearing a watch. I have bought a few over the last couple of months, all of them under €200, which is about £145-150 depending on exchange rate.
From reading a few forum, people who have bought expensive, mainly Swiss watches are very peed off with servicing and more importantly, the standard of factory servicing. Examples include parts being replaced and not returned by AD, eg hands and bezels. I think buyers are going to wise up to this pretty soon and go back to buying cheaper, more reliable watches like seiko that can be serviced locally. If this happens it will be a bigger kick in the teeth to Swiss watches than the quartz crisis in the '70's-80's.
I think there is very good value in the vintage market, especially on ebay for well known brands. There is even better value for lesser well known brands with top quality movements. As Wibbs has mentioned, the heritage range are four times the price of the vintage watches they copy. Another area where really good value can be got is where someone buys a new watch and then decides they don't like it after a month. It seems they can't get rid of it quick enough.
Thankfully I haven't really been looking at the more expensive watches, so can't really comment on them.
Exchange rates do have a big influence especially in the 'new' market. I'm in Ireland, at the moment the euro is weak so I'm going to be looking in the eurozone. As well as this, UK buyers are looking to the eurozone for better value. This is a double whammy effect on UK based sellers.
Markets are fickle, they always were and they always will be.
A lot of talk on this thread is about cheaper to mid range watches, with the occasional mention that higher value watches might not suffer as much. I would like to ask what the forumites think will happen to the high end stuff over the next few years ? If we are talking Rolex for example will the market value of Paul Newman Daytonas, early Submariners and Sea-dwellers, Comex models and Mil-subs etc continue to rise or do you see those becoming harder to sell.
Logically, most of the best examples are already in private hands and fewer and fewer examples fresh to the market are appearing - if a collector suddenly decides to release a treasured item will the market fight for it or will people simply not be willing to part with the cash.
Good investment or yesterdays grail watch ?
Last five years or so SC has really to me become a place of luxury sales. Every other post is a sub.
It used to be a sort of pmwf sc years ago with trasers, Cwc, our hosts plethora and they were all sold at amazingly bargainish prices. Now they sell at the nearly retail price even when they are not new. Someone mentioned the 'I want what I paid for it back attitude'.
Exactly right both parties must be happy,and willing to deal again
I think super rare collector pieces and high end brands will keep their value well due to their rarity and the amount of super rich with money to burn.The mid range brands like Rolex Omega Breitling etc might find things more difficult as their products are becoming more and more expensive £5000+ now and less and less younger people are wearing watches .The Chinese and other new markets are slowing down and that was where a lot of the recent growth was coming from .Too many people are obsessed with the value and depreciation of watches rather than just wearing and enjoying them
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