Cycle turbo trainer advice please!

[MadeOfCheese]

Chaps,

I'm looking to get back into cycling over the winter, so a turbo trainer in the garage is on the cards.

I have an ancient/vintage MTB (a KHS Montaña Team for those interested) with a Shimano XTR 8-speed groupset. The bike is over 25 years old, but the cassette was changed about 8 years ago to something like the equivalent of an XT.

I am looking at a Tacx Vortex Smart trainer. I want to be able to look at videos of mountain passes on the iPad while I cycle so that I don't get bored ;)

Seems like the easiest approach is to also get a cheap spare rear wheel to fit one of those blue trainer tyres to, but I'm unsure about cassette compatibility. Will any Shimano 8-speed cassette do, or do I need something with a specific tooth pattern? I'm happy to replace the chain (probably needs doing again anyway) but I don't want to be causing undue wear.

Any advice, specific or broadly related, gratefully received.

[Valkyrie]

All Shimano 8 speed cassettes have the same spacing and spline pattern. You're not worried about the weight so just buy the cheapest one. If you're anywhere near a Decathlon store they're usually pretty good for this stuff, I also got my trainer tyre there for a lot less than Wiggle or Evans would charge.

I use a Tacx iMagic that links to a PC to control resistance, basically the old version of what you've got. I really like it as compared to a basic turbo-trainer it's a lot more interesting and it keeps me focussed/interested. I usually do about 15 minutes of warm-up, 15 minutes of 30 second high power efforts with 90 second recoveries and then 15 minutes of cool-down. It's important to have a set programme and do intervals - steady riding on turbos is very tedious and not very effective. The videos are quite interesting the first few times you use them but I found that after a while just doing basic programmes on power was what worked best for me.

On my unit there is a calibration function but it's pretty poor. If the tyre resistance is higher/lower than optimum then although the calibration shows that the system doesn't really compensate. Although it displays power output in Watts I take it with a big pinch of salt. It takes a bit of messing about with the tyre pressure and roller position to get a reasonable calibration. Mine's is in the garage and on really cold days it becomes almost impossible to use as the tyre slips too much on the roller. If I had the money I'd switch to a direct drive trainer like the Neo but it's way too spendy for me.

[magirus]

I use a Tacx, with a cheapo back wheel in my winter bike. Tyrewise, I use whatever tyres come off at new tyre time. To beat the boredom factor I have my iPad on an old cheapo sheet music stand that the kids don't use any more with £5 Tesco earbuds. For steady sessions it's whatever TV show or film I fancy and for actual training theres loads of stuff on Youtube you can pedal along with, I just use a rough cadence count and use the videos as a timer for the intervals. The Tacx is a magnet type with 10 levels on a lever that clamps to your bars, and of course you still have all your gears as well. I got the Tacx as a package from Decathlon, it came with a padded floor mat and a front wheel block which the wheel sits in to keep the bike level. I use the mat in the kitchen on bitter cold days, usually I'm in the garage with the door up. Takes about 10 mins to take the bike on or off the Tacx, change wheel etc to use it on the road. It's a great tool that has definitely got me fitter via no missed days from bad weather, today is a good example with strong winds howling outside.

[ggmiller]

Might also be worth looking at Aldi special deals online, they had a look of cycle parts last week, inc a turbo trainer that looked ok to me!

[den77]

Whilst i agree turbo trainers have a place in training they are boring and to work effectively they can be bloody hard work.

I have just been out in the wind and rain this morning for 40 odd miles around some local hills. Took me the best part of three hours with a front wheel puncture. Great fun and made the shower and cup of tea at the end so much more better.

Just my opinion and I do use a turbo (but for specific power based trg) but a ride outside is always better.

[MadeOfCheese]

Thanks for the replies chaps.

I agree that there's no substitute for "getting out there", but I find that most days I just don't have the time, and a quick trip down to the garage is much more likely to happen.

The other factor I'm struggling with is that my arse seems to have become a complete wimp in the last few years. After a 20 mile ride over the bumps of a real road my arse is screaming for mercy!

One of the reasons for getting the turbo trainer is to try and build back up some posterior robustness gradually...

[Valkyrie]

Your backside isn't going to love the turbo at all. Two things -
1. You don't vary your position (at least on my turbo, out of the saddle just doesn't feel great)
2. There's no potholes but there is a constant vibration coming from the roller/tyre interface

For actual road riding I use Brooks leather saddles. I tried putting one on the turbo once to break it in and it was horrible! The turbo bike now always has a saddle with a bit of gel padding in it (a Fizik something or other)

I generally can't be arsed getting the bike out the garage for anything less than about 4 hours, so in winter it's the turbo at least twice a week for me.

[MadeOfCheese]

Interesting. I am currently trying to break in a Brooks saddle, and I had fitted it to a static spin bike that I briefly had in the garage - it was indeed horrible!

I'll make sure i have a gel saddle in reserve...

Thanks again for the advice.

[JP28]

If you can afford it go for a wahoo kickr/snap. Absolutely superb. As road feel as you can get. Intergrates with every app/iPad rtc etc
I ended up buying a 'refurbished' one from the site with came with a good discount and looked absolutely new to me.
Expensive but worth it.

[Maris]

I'm after a smart turbo trainer but I'm currently doing weekly wattbike sessions and anything less than a wattbike now seems a real compromise.
I'm tempted by the Tacx Vortex though.
http://www.dcrainmaker.com/2015/11/2...endations.html

https://www.athleteshop.co.uk/tacx-t...FRMUGwodafMAPQ

[neillp]

I have the tacx votetex smart and it is excellent, you can link it up to Zwift to relieve the boredom but I just set mine on a specific power output and watch tv
You don't need a specific tyre, any road tyre will do. In fact I wouldn't even bother getting a spare wheel, just change the tyre. Changing wheels can be a pain as sometimes you need to re-index the gears (not always but a slight difference in alignment can happen).

[Spike]

Having tried a turbo trainer and deciding I didn't like the experience I ended up with parabolic rollers
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/e...B&gclsrc=aw.ds
Great bit of kit, no special tyres needed, drop the bike on and your ready to go. Although it's worth having a door frame or similar to hand should you loose balance!

[RichUK]

I mount a training tyre on my back wheel, it doesn't take too long to swap the tyres if I want to go out / stay in on the trainer.

My turbo is a Cycleops Powerbeam Pro and I use Trainerroad as my training software on my laptop. I have an old TV in the garage to watch some TV / Netflix whilst I'm on the bike, helps keep the boredom at bay.

[MadeOfCheese]

Well, I've bitten the bullet and gone with an Am@zon Warehouse Cycleops Silencer direct drive trainer. You take the rear wheel out and hook the rear dropouts directly to it, and it has its own cassette installed. I figured that was easier than changing tyres or wheels, and also the direct drive ones get very good feedback regarding the feel.

It's not as good as the Wahoo Kickr because it's not "smart", but I figured I'd just watch TV episodes anyway. Also, for £350 I didn't think I could go too far wrong.
If a second hand Kickr comes along I may well upgrade...

Cheers for the advice all

[racingclub]

Vortex Smart with Trainerroad on my Mac connected to a telly in my garage - usually with some Sufferfest vids to keep me interested.

Would like to try Zwift, but my old MacBook struggles with the graphics.

[yogi bear]

Ive got a very old, very basic Tacx magnet job.

Bluetooth headphones & a specific "turbo" playlist on my iPhone.

Use my Garmin for hr & cadence & just the bikes gears...

I can raise the temperature in the garage by a couple of degrees on a cold day after a good session!

[gunner]

Having tried a turbo trainer and deciding I didn't like the experience I ended up with parabolic rollers
http://www.chainreactioncycles.com/e...B&gclsrc=aw.ds
Great bit of kit, no special tyres needed, drop the bike on and your ready to go. Although it's worth having a door frame or similar to hand should you loose balance!

Same here, getting bored is not an option...

[racingclub]

are the rollers hard to 'learn' ? It sounds a fun alternative, just not sure I'm up for falling off the bike in the garage...

[Puntsdog]

I think you can buy a stand to steady your front wheel but I suppose that comes at the expense of fully exercising your core muscles.

[gunner]

are the rollers hard to 'learn' ? It sounds a fun alternative, just not sure I'm up for falling off the bike in the garage...

Not really. Odd sensation at first though.

Start with one hand on a wall or door frame then let go once you're 'moving'. I found it best to focus on a point c.20ft in front of me as if I was on the road.

[yogi bear]

Going to ask Santa for some rollers...

[trident-7]

I've got the 3" alloy Kreitler rollers which are great. I use them mainly for warming up for time trials. I wouldn't recommend the 2.25" ones unless you can put out 400W for more than a few minutes. You can get a fork stand for them but it's more fun without & one of the great bonuses of riding the rollers is that it teaches you how to pedal smoothly, fluidly & efficiently. If you don't you don't stay on them for long

[magirus]

I raided the old parts drawers in the garage and built this up yesterday to sit permanently on the turbo trainer for the winter. I had my current wet/winter bike on there but it was a faff when I wanted to take it out on the road, ie take it off the turbo, swap the back wheel, remove resistance control and stopwatch from bar tops, refit lamp brackets to bar tops etc. It's a mix of 8speed Campag mechs and shifters with a 7speed Shimano hub and cassette, the sprocket spacings are the same so it works well. The stem is higher than I'd ever ride it on the road, but my position is the same as on my other bikes, ie comparatively upright and back friendly.

[PipPip]

My wife and I both do a lot of turbo training. We probably do between 5 and 8 hours a week each. I target 100 miles on the turbo a week if time allows. I personally think people who say it's "boring" are just not doing it right. I do Trainer Road programmes on a MacBook Pro. I set it up in horizontal view mode with the data across the bottom of the screen and watch Netflix with bluetooth earplugs. The combination of varied programmes, following the target power and watching Netflix simultaneously keeps it interesting and entertaining. I've been turbo training for a year and have dropped from 86kgs to 72kgs in that time. Its absolutely transformed my health and fitness.
My wife uses Zwift and is a very keen member of their female academy. She is getting very good with her average watts per kilo being around 4.1. She often wins women's races and indeed beats most of the guys in mixed races. She's more competitive than me and the regular racing plus the friendly female Zwift community aspects mean she is addicted to turbo training. Zwift ran a blog on her earlier this year: https://zwift.com/blog/148-czech-you...-zwift-academy
Our set up is pretty basic. A non-smart Elite Chrono gel turbo, laptop and a Dyson fan. We use my old Specialized Secteur with a turbo tyre and just move the saddle up and down. I expect our next big purchase will be a Wahoo Kickr for Christmas though! Our set up:

[magirus]

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
The above reminds me I really must get a fan.

[trident-7]

Get a REALLY powerful fan. Overheating is a sure way to make your power drop off. It's nature's way of keeping you alive ;-)

The one I use is like a hurricane, although I have a less powerful one for winter. This is in the garage with the door open. Turboing in a centrally heated house doesn't bear thinking about

[PipPip]

The Dyson fan was pricey but it's great. The remote allows you to gradually crank it up as you get hotter. Our turbo is in an office on the side of our house. Luckily the office is naturally cool as its single story, single glazed and an old property with a thatched roof.

[Meesterbond]

My wife and I both do a lot of turbo training. We probably do between 5 and 8 hours a week each. I target 100 miles on the turbo a week if time allows. I personally think people who say it's "boring" are just not doing it right. I do Trainer Road programmes on a MacBook Pro. I set it up in horizontal view mode with the data across the bottom of the screen and watch Netflix with bluetooth earplugs. The combination of varied programmes, following the target power and watching Netflix simultaneously keeps it interesting and entertaining. I've been turbo training for a year and have dropped from 86kgs to 72kgs in that time. Its absolutely transformed my health and fitness.
My wife uses Zwift and is a very keen member of their female academy. She is getting very good with her average watts per kilo being around 4.1. She often wins women's races and indeed beats most of the guys in mixed races. She's more competitive than me and the regular racing plus the friendly female Zwift community aspects mean she is addicted to turbo training. Zwift ran a blog on her earlier this year: https://zwift.com/blog/148-czech-you...-zwift-academy
Our set up is pretty basic. A non-smart Elite Chrono gel turbo, laptop and a Dyson fan. We use my old Specialized Secteur with a turbo tyre and just move the saddle up and down. I expect our next big purchase will be a Wahoo Kickr for Christmas though! Our set up

I'd have a look at the Tacx Neo as well - I got one six months or so back and it is excellent... Almost completely silent (really), has a little bit of side-to-side movement so feels a bit more natural than ones that are completely solid. Will do everything the Kickr does but, you get a bit of feedback through the flywheel so if you're going over cobbles or wooden boards, as you do from time to time on Zwift, you get the rumble of the road surface... only a minor thing but any distraction is good!

[PipPip]

I'd have a look at the Tacx Neo as well - I got one six months or so back and it is excellent... Almost completely silent (really), has a little bit of side-to-side movement so feels a bit more natural than ones that are completely solid. Will do everything the Kickr does but, you get a bit of feedback through the flywheel so if you're going over cobbles or wooden boards, as you do from time to time on Zwift, you get the rumble of the road surface... only a minor thing but any distraction is good!

My wife is doing a Zwift race in about a weeks time where first prize is a Neo. I've told her she has to win or she's out.

[Uriel]

The Neo is great, in most respects, but it's nowhere near stable enough for any real high power riding out of the saddle. I've never had a problem with any turbo in the past, but my Neo is all over the place.