Electric cars-got to be a viable option now?

[Passenger]

I don’t mind, it’s not a complex story!

I dipped my toe in the EV world with a BMW i3 back in 2014, the one with the small range extender engine under the boot floor.

I then got an e-Golf 4 years later, I wanted to go full EV, then work threw me a curve ball a year into owning that and I needed to travel further once a week. I did it for a while but a longer range car suited me better and meant I didn’t need to charge each way, so got the ID.3 which covered my commute nicely.

Then my wife decided it was time to leave the company car scheme she was in, didn’t want another diesel, and decided on the Tesla.

With rising values of the ID.3, and my desire for an even longer range car with AWD, I managed to sell the ID.3 for more than I paid and got the ID.4 GTX about 10 months ago.

I have no plans to buy anything else anytime soon, but all the old EVs are still serving somebody else well, the logical conclusion being that 3 old ICE cars have gone to car heaven.

I get Harry’s point re not chopping and changing, but if you’re needing or wanting to change your car, then considering an EV isn’t a terrible option. It’s not like the building of any car is made from fluff and ribbons, it’s a dirty business at the start, but whole life emissions are far lower with an EV, even ones that aren’t carbon neutral at point of delivery like VWs ID models.

I know lots of people on here own more than one house, have several children, they fly several times a year and often with a cruise in between, all huge carbon generators. None of us are ‘green’, and that goes for people who buy an EV and think they’ve ‘done their bit’.

I'm not sure the logic is sound about the 3 ICE cars necessarily going to heaven...as the range on those early couple of EV's doesn't sound all that, they weren't brilliant for you otherwise you'd not have traded up, quite likely their new owners have to run an ICE vehicle as well for long distance, weekends away eyc...but then that's pioneering for you, but heck as you say, no point quibbling as there's others with bigger footprints, several children even, yea gods!... it's all probably displacement activity, green washing at best while enriching Musk and other manufacturers...For example one of my BiL's in the USA, he's got a large Lexus SUV, damnned if can recall the model ice obvs, his missus some kind of van that'll seat about 8 Ice also..and in the far end of the garage a chevy bolt which his missus uses occasionally for fun I think when she remembers they've got it... the house is vast for the 2 plus 2 kids of them, a lotta bedrooms, 6 bathrooms...the heating/ cooling costs must be phenomenal...they're in a pretty typical set up for their area, wealth bracket. Hey Ho.
Have a great weekend.

[Tooks]

I'm not sure the logic is sound about the 3 ICE cars necessarily going to heaven...as the range on those early couple of EV's doesn't sound all that, they weren't brilliant for you otherwise you'd not have traded up, quite likely their new owners have to run an ICE vehicle as well for long distance, weekends away eyc....
Have a great weekend.

Two car households are often perfect for a 1st Gen EV, or for people like my father who drives about 20 miles a week. His health means no driving really now, but that’s another story…

The EV does the shorter trips into town/supermarket/school etc, the ICE car does fewer miles as a result but is there for much longer trips.

I only sold them as my requirements are for fewer bit longer range trips, they were still doable in the early cars, but not everybody uses a car like I do, or you even.

Have a great weekend too!

[J J Carter]

This is pure hearsay, but anyway...A friend has been waiting and waiting for an MG MG4, the promised September, then December delivery dates have been and gone.

The rumour is that MG have had a massive ICT failure and as a result they've lost all the location information on vehicles. They've been left with no option but send people around to every storage compound and dockside and check every car's VIN number, then manually match-up to who the buyer was for that car and arrange delivery. As I said, only hearsay

[RobDad]

Seems a bit odd on the MG4, I was told about 8 weeks from order to delivery when I test drove one (and decided not to go ahead) back in November


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[StackH]

Seems a bit odd on the MG4, I was told about 8 weeks from order to delivery when I test drove one (and decided not to go ahead) back in November


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I was also told 8 weeks when I ordered in mid-September. It still hadn’t arrived when I cancelled the order just after Christmas. I don’t think the dealers actually know when the cars are due.

[joe narvey]

Tesla cuts prices by up to a fifth to boost demand https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-64266471

Ouch, this would sting if you’d just taken delivery.

Edit: I see it’s covered in part above, but more U.K. detail in the BBC report.

[reggie747]

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Ouch, this would sting if you’d just taken delivery.

I'd guess 999 out of 1000 of these are on a lease of sorts but I hear you.

[Chris_in_the_UK]

Tesla cuts prices by up to a fifth to boost demand https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-64266471

Ouch, this would sting if you’d just taken delivery.

Edit: I see it’s covered in part above, but more U.K. detail in the BBC report.

I have said all along, anybody who buys a Tesla with their own money is nuts - it's a zero sum game. Lease companies factor all of this into the deals they push so it matters not to them if a car has little value at the end.

[JGJG]

I'd guess 999 out of 1000 of these are on a lease of sorts but I hear you.

Surely if the cost falls the cost of a lease would (in time) fall?

[Tooks]

Surely if the cost falls the cost of a lease would (in time) fall?

Depends on what Tesla’s Yo-Yo pricing does to the residuals?

Prices are about back where they were before the supply chain stuff kicked off, the unknown is what they do next.

[Passenger]

Depends on what Tesla’s Yo-Yo pricing does to the residuals?

Prices are about back where they were before the supply chain stuff kicked off, the unknown is what they do next.

But with consumer demand apparently falling and interest rates rising and a global recession of course, isn't it unlikely prices won't fall, if they want to shift vehicles that is...isn´t the only unknown really if we´re being honest, realistic, how far prices will come down...

[Tooks]

But with consumer demand apparently falling and interest rates rising and a global recession of course, isn't it unlikely prices won't fall, if they want to shift vehicles that is...isn´t the only unknown really how far prices will lower...

Well, I’m not Mike Brewer or Quentin Wilson, so I’d just be guessing, but I would have thought those factors would play in yes.

But, there are plenty of ‘recession proof’ people out there as well, perhaps the people most impacted by this were never in the market for a £40-50k EV anyway?

When I was browsing the Tesla site yesterday after the price drops, the base M3 was showing 1-2 weeks delivery, so on a ship already. That’s now stretched to 2-4 weeks, so probably still on a ship, but other models are showing as March delivery onwards.

Meantime, lead times for other decent EVs are still stretching out into the distance, they literally can’t keep up with demand. Similar for popular ICE cars.

If people are hoping it’s the death of the electric car or a prelude to across the board price drops, they might be disappointed.

Tesla will do anything to keep their market share, what they do isn’t necessarily what everybody else will, although they’ve asked some interesting questions.

Our Tesla is a great EV, no doubt, but I don’t think we’ll be buying another one, for a variety of reasons.

[Christian]

Tesla cuts prices by up to a fifth to boost demand https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-64266471

Ouch, this would sting if you’d just taken delivery.

Edit: I see it’s covered in part above, but more U.K. detail in the BBC report.

I saw this on another newspaper and saw comments from annoyed customers who took delivery in December saying Tesla was the cause of them "losing £7000" and they should be compensated. I don't really understand the logic...they bought a car at a price they were happy with at the time. Whilst it must be a bitter pill to swallow, I don't see it as Tesla's duty to ensure they retain value...it's a car, not a guaranteed asset?

I still struggle to get my head round modern demand for luxury £40k+ cars. When the average annual salary is £38k, it seems out of balance.

[Passenger]

Well, I’m not Mike Brewer or Quentin Wilson, so I’d just be guessing, but I would have thought those factors would play in yes.

But, there are plenty of ‘recession proof’ people out there as well, perhaps the people most impacted by this were never in the market for a £40-50k EV anyway?

When I was browsing the Tesla site yesterday after the price drops, the base M3 was showing 1-2 weeks delivery, so on a ship already. That’s now stretched to 2-4 weeks, so probably still on a ship, but other models are showing as March delivery onwards.

Meantime, lead times for other decent EVs are still stretching out into the distance, they literally can’t keep up with demand. Similar for popular ICE cars.

If people are hoping it’s the death of the electric car or a prelude to across the board price drops, they might be disappointed.

Tesla will do anything to keep their market share, what they do isn’t necessarily what everybody else will, although they’ve asked some interesting questions.

Our Tesla is a great EV, no doubt, but I don’t think we’ll be buying another one, for a variety of reasons.

I´m struggling to follow your logic...sure there´s the rich folks who´ve probably done well of late, the last couple of years if anything enhancing, securing their positions and financial- tax arrangements, whom any recession will roll right off...but the title of the thread I thought was really about EV´s becoming viable for the general population, the masses...Maybe I´ve been looking at this all wrong, my apologies.

Tesla´s interesting cos it´s not so much the cars as it is about the share price, that´s the real ´product´. Musk might end up trying to catch a falling knife, end up chasing his own tail down, which´d serve him right, be quite funny really. What he can´t control is what the other automotive manufacturers do.

Interesting times.

[Franky Four Fingers]

I ordered our VW back in July, guy promised them Late Oct-Nov, then changed his tune and said December and mid late December told us January….he actually bet his mortgage on that happening….silly git. I keep on meaning to ring up and ask him for the deeds but no doubt he’ll forget his catalogue of bu**SH*t
Theyve also dropped the model spec we were having but by all accounts pre-orders will be fulfilled despite guys on the ID forums saying that they've had the they're specced dropped to either a Style or Tech. Simple fact now is that we were never going to get them despite from day one our questioning him of his dates.
There are however loads of lower spec cars coming through so that’s what we've done, swapped the agreements via VW for a pair of Styles and they're actually in stock at the dealer…just waiting for the paperwork now. VW are in a bad place as most of their facilities for wiring harnesses are based in Ukraine, reading the press it seems that a coupe were destroyed whilst one is under daily fire! So i can hardly complain, it it what it is but i despise the salesman utter rubbish, if he'd had been upfront from day one i wouldn't have even contacted him yet and would have probably expected them mid this year.

[Passenger]

I ordered our VW back in July, guy promised them Late Oct-Nov, then changed his tune and said December and mid late December told us January….he actually bet his mortgage on that happening….silly git. I keep on meaning to ring up and ask him for the deeds but no doubt he’ll forget his catalogue of bu**SH*t
Theyve also dropped the model spec we were having but by all accounts pre-orders will be fulfilled despite guys on the ID forums saying that they've had the they're specced dropped to either a Style or Tech. Simple fact now is that we were never going to get them despite from day one our questioning him of his dates.
There are however loads of lower spec cars coming through so that’s what we've done, swapped the agreements via VW for a pair of Styles and they're actually in stock at the dealer…just waiting for the paperwork now. VW are in a bad place as most of their facilities for wiring harnesses are based in Ukraine, reading the press it seems that a coupe were destroyed whilst one is under daily fire! So i can hardly complain, it it what it is but i despise the salesman utter rubbish, if he'd had been upfront from day one i wouldn't have even contacted him yet and would have probably expected them mid this year.

Pardon my ignorance Franky but can I ask, so which model are you now expecting to get?

[Franky Four Fingers]

Pardon my ignorance Franky but can I ask, so which model are you now expecting to get?

So originally they were max pros now weve gone for Style pros….i have no idea why one is more readily available than the other, perhaps the cars with the higher spec and tech rely on the Ukraine harnesses and lower spec is made elsewhere.

[Passenger]

I saw this on another newspaper and saw comments from annoyed customers who took delivery in December saying Tesla was the cause of them "losing £7000" and they should be compensated. I don't really understand the logic...they bought a car at a price they were happy with at the time. Whilst it must be a bitter pill to swallow, I don't see it as Tesla's duty to ensure they retain value...it's a car, not a guaranteed asset?

I still struggle to get my head round modern demand for luxury £40k+ cars. When the average annual salary is £38k, it seems out of balance.

That sums up part of my own mystification...Average salary is about 28-30k, but you take London and the south out the mix it really isn´t that high for many of those hoping to be levelled up.

Well I guess those buyers weren´t the recession proof types, the instant 7 k depreciation on their shiny new toy must sting rather a lot, that sense of feeling like a bit of a mug, their friends would know it too, if they follow the news.

Thanks Franky.

[Pitfitter]

Won’t the Uk depreciation only affect folk who are actually buying their cars? Aren’t most deals PCP or lease or whatever that have a guaranteed minimum value at the end, a salesman at VW I spoke to the end of last year told that way would he advise people to buy an ev, residues are so hard to project that it could be worth next to nothing in the future as owners, no leccy car for daughter then as at 30k miles annually lease deals are hard to find. Ah well, diesel it is then.

[Tooks]

Won’t the Uk depreciation only affect folk who are actually buying their cars? Aren’t most deals PCP or lease or whatever that have a guaranteed minimum value at the end, a salesman at VW I spoke to the end of last year told that way would he advise people to buy an ev, residues are so hard to project that it could be worth next to nothing in the future as owners, no leccy car for daughter then as at 30k miles annually lease deals are hard to find. Ah well, diesel it is then.

If you’re on a PCP, the risk for final values sits with the supplying dealer at the end of it, assuming you’ve kept to the mileage limits etc.

Not sure why a salesman would be talking down residuals on the EV, perhaps he was trying to steer you towards something that he could actually get hold of anytime soon?

Residuals do impact the lease and PCP price, but I guess it has become harder to predict them with all the supply chain uncertainty.

[Tooks]

...but the title of the thread I thought was really about EV´s becoming viable for the general population, the masses...Maybe I´ve been looking at this all wrong, my apologies.

In fairness, the title of the thread is are they viable, and yes they are.

Are they affordable is a different question, but I’d argue that as most private cars are purchased on finance of some sort, if you can afford to PCP a BMW 320d, then you can afford to finance and run an EV.

Most used EVs are coming from the business lease side, over the next 2 or 3 years they’ll be heating the dealers used stock and I can see them becoming more affordable.

[J J Carter]

I know a fairly well remunerated chap who put his name down get to two EVs. One has turned up, but this was to be the family's 2nd car so the PCP mileage ceiling is small, something like 6,000 miles.

There's still no date for delivery of the other EV, so he's burning through the mileage allowance on the one he has far quicker than expected.

He's now looking at buying a regular petrol car to fill the gap until the other EV arrives...

[reggie747]

if you can afford to PCP a BMW 320d, then you can afford to finance and run an EV.

Won't that equate to an MG or similar though ??

Not really in the same league is it ?

[Passenger]

Won't that equate to an MG or similar though ??

Not really in the same league is it ?

There you go, point well made.

[stuie-t]

Won't that equate to an MG or similar though ??

Not really in the same league is it ?

A 320d is around £42k, whilst an i4 starts at £52k so not a huge premium given the extra performance


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[Tooks]

Won't that equate to an MG or similar though ??

Not really in the same league is it ?

According to CarWow, leasing a 320d is around £550-590 a month over 10k miles per annum, the base i4 is £690, or around £100 a month more.

There’s a fuel saving of around £80 a month with the i4 as well, so hardly anything in it.

You’re right though, not really in the same league, you’d probably need something with an M badge to match the i4 performance, which would be more cash.

Talking of cash, the 320d is about £45k, and lacking some of the kit on the i4, the i4 appears to be around £56k, but again you’d probably need to compare a few models up from the 320d to get comparable performance.

[Tooks]

There you go, point well made.

One minute you want affordable, the next you want it to be the same as a BMW 3 Series. Sheesh! :oD

See my previous post, costs are very comparable even if you stick with BMWs.

The good news is, nobody is forcing anybody to buy a new EV, you can buy a new anything but that for over a decade still, and good used ICE cars will be around for much longer than that, probably.

[Passenger]

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/bmw/3-...-5dr-step-auto

38.2 k...?

If the EV we´re comparing it to starts at 56 K... almost 18 k more...

[Tooks]

https://www.autoexpress.co.uk/bmw/3-...-5dr-step-auto

38.2 k...?

If the EV we´re comparing it to starts at 56 K... almost 18 k more...

How old is that review you’ve linked to?

Price from the horses mouth, and check out carwow, all prices have headed north.

https://configure.bmw.co.uk/en_GB/co...?expanded=true

£43,460, before any options and in flat white…

It’s not a fair comparison anyway, I know I mentioned the 320d, but you need to be looking further up the food chain to get a similar vehicle to the i4.

I’m not sure what you’re not seeing? If you’re happy to splurge £550 a month on a 320d, and plenty of people appear to, then for the price of the fuel saved you could be driving something like the i4 instead.

I cover 25k miles a year, I’m saving just shy of £5k a year in fuel to a comparable size and performance ICE car, even after I’ve paid for the electricity to cover those miles.

[Passenger]

How old is that review you’ve linked to?

Price from the horses mouth, and check out carwow, all prices have headed north.

https://configure.bmw.co.uk/en_GB/co...?expanded=true

£43,460, before any options and in flat white…

It’s not a fair comparison anyway, I know I mentioned the 320d, but you need to be looking further up the food chain to get a similar vehicle to the i4.

I’m not sure what you’re not seeing? If you’re happy to splurge £550 a month on a 320d, and plenty of people appear to, then for the price of the fuel saved you could be driving something like the i4 instead.

I cover 25k miles a year, I’m saving just shy of £5k a year in fuel to a comparable size and performance ICE car, even after I’ve paid for the electricity to cover those miles.

No it's OK you're right, had the out of date info, sorry, don't mind me.

[Tooks]

No it's OK you're right, had the out of date info, sorry, don't mind me.

No worries mate! :-)

Happy to try and help where I can, Injnow you’re not in the market for one, but others might be.

[jaytip]

That sums up part of my own mystification...Average salary is about 28-30k, but you take London and the south out the mix it really isn´t that high for many of those hoping to be levelled up.

Well I guess those buyers weren´t the recession proof types, the instant 7 k depreciation on their shiny new toy must sting rather a lot, that sense of feeling like a bit of a mug, their friends would know it too, if they follow the news.

Thanks Franky.

Chances are, the Teslas bought by people on a not so high wage, would by via PCP, so the loss in value of the Teslas, would have zero impact on them financially.

[Passenger]

Chances are, the Teslas bought by people on a not so high wage, would by via PCP, so the loss in value of the Teslas, would have zero impact on them financially.

Chances are though they´ll always be poor, at best work until 70, because they fritter away 500- 600 quid pcm on their car, oh well takes all sorts.

[Mr Curta]

Chances are though they´ll always be poor, at best work until 70, because they fritter away 500- 600 quid pcm on their car, oh well takes all sorts.

Many people are very happy to live like that particularly if they enjoy their work and there's an atmosphere of camaraderie and support. There are many paths to contentment in this life and as long as they don't cause harm to others no one is better than another.

[Passenger]

Many people are very happy to live like that particularly if they enjoy their work and there's an atmosphere of camaraderie and support. There are many paths to contentment in this life and as long as they don't cause harm to others no one is better than another.

All might be well until they´re not well and need an operation, treatment or the boiler inconveniently packs up. But yup you´re right mr C , it´s none of my beeswax, purview.

[Franky Four Fingers]

Chances are though they´ll always be poor, at best work until 70, because they fritter away 500- 600 quid pcm on their car, oh well takes all sorts.

Guess what makes you happy, id rather have a little bit of what i want rather than sit in a cold house with no lights on living like a skinflint. My brother is a prime example, sat on a fortune and is the tightest bastard in history….he'd skin a turn for a tenner. When he's cold in his grave I'm sure the money will keep him warm.

[Passenger]

Guess what makes you happy, id rather have a little bit of what i want rather than sit in a cold house with no lights on living like a skinflint. My brother is a prime example, sat on a fortune and is the tightest bastard in history….he'd skin a turn for a tenner. When he's cold in his grave I'm sure the money will keep him warm.

You don´t need to guess...I managed to stop work at 40 from a working class start, moved somewhere with 300 days sunshine a year, no mortgage for over a decade, lovely countryside views, swimming pool in the back yard, coast and mountains nearby and a nice city 20 minutes away...why not have all of what you want, we´re a long time dead after all...It´s 19 C right now, but for the wife testing positive for covid last night and me having symptoms but no positive test as yet, we´d have been out playing petanque in the sunshine with fellow villagers this morning, grrrr bloody covid...still into every life a little rain must fall.
Have a nice day.

Sorry for the thread deviation.

[Tooks]

You don´t need to guess...I managed to stop work at 40 from a working class start, moved somewhere with 300 days sunshine a year, no mortgage for over a decade, lovely countryside views, swimming pool in the back yard, coast and mountains nearby and a nice city 20 minutes away...why not have all of what you want, we´re a long time dead after all...It´s 19 C right now, but for the wife testing positive for covid last night and me having symptoms but no positive test yet we´d have been out playing petanque in the sunshine with fellow villagers this morning, grrrr bloody covid...still into every life a little rain must fall.
Have a nice day.

Am I going mad or was it you who suffered a sickening attack from a stranger in the street?

If so, glad you managed to turn something horrific into something positive.

Life has got to be a balance, my mum worked as an NHS nurse all her life (apart from raising us kids for a bit) and was all set for a very comfortable retirement at aged 60, but got bowel cancer and was dead by 61.

I could possibly retire in a couple of years, I have a young daughter though, and I love what I do and work doesn’t much feel like work for me at all.

Like a lot of people on here I got into the multiple house game, but have just one home now, and from selling the last one purchased a couple of EVs. ;-)

I’m happy working, not just retiring. As others have said, each to their own, and let’s not judge.

[Passenger]

Am I going mad or was it you who suffered a sickening attack from a stranger in the street?

If so, glad you managed to turn something horrific into something positive.

Life has got to be a balance, my mum worked as an NHS nurse all her life (apart from raising us kids for a bit) and was all set for a very comfortable retirement at aged 60, but got bowel cancer and was dead by 61.

I could possibly retire in a couple of years, I have a young daughter though, and I love what I do and work doesn’t much feel like work for me at all.

Like a lot of people on here I got into the multiple house game, but have just one home now, and from selling the last one purchased a couple of EVs. ;-)

I’m happy working, not just retiring.

Yes in London, Lil´ gangsters, I could´ve been a statistic...it makes you think. Sorry about your Mum, I´ve seen too many ´good´ people go early.

I´m happy you love your work, wow, I never managed to find that, not in the paid work sense at least...I get bored quickly, low tolerance for eff wits, the politics. I do mostly love being Dad in fairness, best job to date.

I´ll shut up now, didn´t mean to go far off piste, the question was kinda put my way.

Happy Sunday everyone.

[Tooks]

Yes in London, I could´ve been a statistic...it makes you think. Sorry about your Mum, I´ve seen too many ´good´ people go early.

I´m happy you love your work, wow, I never managed to find that, not in the paid work sense at least...I get bored quickly, low tolerance for eff wits, the politics. I do mostly love being Dad in fairness, best job to date.

I´ll shut up now, didn´t mean to go far off piste, the question was kinda put my way.

Happy Sunday everyone.

Thanks Passenger, it was back in 2012, I still miss her a lot.

Happy Sunday to you too, hope the Covid stuff is brief and painless!

[Mr Curta]

You don´t need to guess...I managed to stop work at 40 from a working class start, moved somewhere with 300 days sunshine a year, no mortgage for over a decade, lovely countryside views, swimming pool in the back yard, picture postcard views, coast and mountains nearby and a nice city 20 minutes away...why not have all of what you want...It´s 19 C right now, but for the wife testing positive for covid last night and me having symptoms but no positive test yet we´d have been out playing petanque in the sunshine with fellow villagers this morning, grrrr bloody covid...still into every life a little rain must fall.
Have a nice day.

That's what you see as an idyll and well done for chasing your dream but there are a billion other viewpoints. You post as though everyone else should see your lifestyle as something to aspire to, and few will as they all have different things that bring them joy. It's certainly a million miles from what my family looks for climate-wise when we head off for a few years overseas, and I can't imagine wishing to retire early as I absolutely love the teams I work with and the obscure travel opportunities my work offers.

I'm not one for living on the never-never but I know many people who are very happy just getting by and really just want to be close to family or friends.

In the context of this thread, an EV is proving to be a very viable option for us. Saved up and paid cash (30k second-hand). Although I'm a bit of a tree-hugger there was a definite financial element as interest rates made investments unattractive at the time, but the fuel saving of £300 odd a month was an instant return. I have subsidised charging at the office under a solar canopy and am with a 'green' energy supplier so feel that I'm doing a tiny bit for the planet. It's early days but burning fossil fuels is clearly both unsustainable and a massive contributor to climate change so it's only a matter of time before ICE are consigned to the history books.

[Peck]

That's what you see as an idyll and well done for chasing your dream but there are a billion other viewpoints. You post as though everyone else should see your lifestyle as something to aspire to, and few will as they all have different things that bring them joy. It's certainly a million miles from what my family looks for climate-wise when we head off for a few years overseas, and I can't imagine wishing to retire early as I absolutely love the teams I work with and the obscure travel opportunities my work offers.

I'm not one for living on the never-never but I know many people who are very happy just getting by and really just want to be close to family or friends.

In the context of this thread, an EV is proving to be a very viable option for us. Saved up and paid cash (30k second-hand). Although I'm a bit of a tree-hugger there was a definite financial element as interest rates made investments unattractive at the time, but the fuel saving of £300 odd a month was an instant return. I have subsidised charging at the office under a solar canopy and am with a 'green' energy supplier so feel that I'm doing a tiny bit for the planet. It's early days but burning fossil fuels is clearly both unsustainable and a massive contributor to climate change so it's only a matter of time before ICE are consigned to the history books.

Post of the day Matthew. Wish I was this eloquent!

[Passenger]

That's what you see as an idyll and well done for chasing your dream but there are a billion other viewpoints. You post as though everyone else should see your lifestyle as something to aspire to, and few will as they all have different things that bring them joy. It's certainly a million miles from what my family looks for climate-wise when we head off for a few years overseas, and I can't imagine wishing to retire early as I absolutely love the teams I work with and the obscure travel opportunities my work offers.

I'm not one for living on the never-never but I know many people who are very happy just getting by and really just want to be close to family or friends.

In the context of this thread, an EV is proving to be a very viable option for us. Saved up and paid cash (30k second-hand). Although I'm a bit of a tree-hugger there was a definite financial element as interest rates made investments unattractive at the time, but the fuel saving of £300 odd a month was an instant return. I have subsidised charging at the office under a solar canopy and am with a 'green' energy supplier so feel that I'm doing a tiny bit for the planet. It's early days but burning fossil fuels is clearly both unsustainable and a massive contributor to climate change so it's only a matter of time before ICE are consigned to the history books.

Never my intention to post as though it's a lifestyle others should aspire to, just wanted to respond to the suggestion I'm never happier than sitting in the cold and dark counting the coins...the reality couldn't be further.

You head overseas for years at a time, wow, lucky you...you also seem quite far from the middle ground of plugging away, just getting by, happy with what you've always known, IF I may make the observation.

Glad you like your motor, that sense of doing your bit, nice.

[J J Carter]

US based online car-reseller - "Here's Why Tesla Car Values Have Dropped So Fast"

[Tooks]

US based online car-reseller - "Here's Why Tesla Car Values Have Dropped So Fast"

Here in the UK, the drops weren’t as big, and they’re back to the prices being asked around late 2020/early 2021, which feels about right.

Tesla have had a couple of good years, but I see why folks who’ve just purchased might be feeling differently.

[Alex L]

I have subsidised charging at the office under a solar canopy.

Don’t take this the wrong way but I see a lot of comments about solar canopies over chargers, the reality is they provide just about enough power to keep the canopy lights illuminated. It’s more a PR exercise by CPOs to look green.

[Tooks]

Don’t take this the wrong way but I see a lot of comments about solar canopies over chargers, the reality is they provide just about enough power to keep the canopy lights illuminated. It’s more a PR exercise by CPOs to look green.

I think it would depend on the size of the solar array we’re talking about?

One of my neighbours works for a company that installs them, the gull wing type over a full parking space or parking area. They provide a genuinely useful amount of electricity, albeit much reduced this time of year.

Every little helps, to coin a phrase!

[Alex L]

I think it would depend on the size of the solar array we’re talking about?

One of my neighbours works for a company that installs them, the gull wing type over a full parking space or parking area. They provide a genuinely useful amount of electricity, albeit much reduced this time of year.

Every little helps, to coin a phrase!

If we’re talking a 50 acre array then yes but solar canopies are purely for PR and a way to appease planners.

A 16 charger ultra rapid hub requires around 2mva of power, which would power around 800 homes. A couple of solar panels on a canopy is a drop in the ocean by comparison.

[Tooks]

If we’re talking a 50 acre array then yes but solar canopies are purely for PR and a way to appease planners.

A 16 charger ultra rapid hub requires around 2mva of power, which would power around 800 homes. A couple of solar panels on a canopy is a drop in the ocean by comparison.

I think the chap was talking about a work place AC charger that has a few panels on a canopy to supplement it, not a 16 rapid charger hub?

Gridserve do exactly the 50 acre array thing, their core business is grid balancing and smoothing via solar and battery infrastructure.

Even they don’t claim solar provides all the power to their EV fuel stations, but clearly even if it does only cover the lighting then that’s a good thing.

[Mr Curta]

I think the chap was talking about a work place AC charger that has a few panels on a canopy to supplement it, not a 16 rapid charger hub?

Gridserve do exactly the 50 acre array thing, their core business is grid balancing and smoothing via solar and battery infrastructure.

Even they don’t claim solar provides all the power to their EV fuel stations, but clearly even if it does only cover the lighting then that’s a good thing.

Yes, it's a bunch of 7kW sockets for slow top up charging during office hours, which is more than enough for most daily commutes. During weekends and summer evenings the panels are charging batteries and feeding other areas. It might be a drop in the ocean but I'm pretty sure that they provide more than 'just about enough power to keep the canopy lights illuminated'.