Will Paula Venells ever be held accountable?

[Griswold]

She’s coming across as the most unaccomplished liar so far!

[PickleB]

She’s coming across as the most unaccomplished liar so far!

To my mind, AvdB spent the latter part of this morning attempting to refute Counsel's suggestion that he may have perjured herself before the High Court. She seemed to say that she didn't because she didn't fully understand, realise the import of, take cognisance of, etc emails she received flagging up bugs with the Horizon system before she admits to knowing about them.

Unfortunately, the proof of perjury requires the prosecution to show that the defendant:

• wilfully making a material statement which is false; and
• knew that it is false or did not believie it to be true.

...and that state of mind may be difficult to demonstrate.

Does anyone know, please, what standard of proof is required in proceedings for perjury...ie is it 'beyond reasonable doubt' or 'balance of probabilty'? Given that the offence is criminal, I suspect that it is the former.

It would be nice if the Inquiry would supply her with a box of paper tissues and she chose to blow her nose rather than sniffing her way through her evidence.

[adrianw]

You can't be in the job and then claim no responsibility for your actions, incompetence is no excuse

[PickleB]

You can't be in the job and then claim no responsibility for your actions, incompetence is no excuse

Agreed...but liability (if eventually demonstrated) is not evidence of perjury.

[brigant]

Her body language was extremely defensive. Continually fiddling with her hands and crossing arms.

There's a lot of these people trying to obfuscate, twist out of their responsibilities and have bad memory lapses.

[oldoakknives]

Her body language was extremely defensive. Continually fiddling with her hands and crossing arms.

There's a lot of these people trying to obfuscate, twist out of their responsibilities and have bad memory lapses.

Have they learned nothing from the BBC? Just claim 'mental health' and head off into the sunset with a fat pension.

[Griswold]

You can't be in the job and then claim no responsibility for your actions, incompetence is no excuse

Indeed, but based on the people interviewed in the Horizon enquiry it pays well. When I was young I was told 'Cream Rises To The Top', I think a better expression would be 'Scum Floats' in these cases. Genuinely, how do these people get such jobs?

[Chris_in_the_UK]

Indeed, but based on the people interviewed in the Horizon enquiry it pays well. When I was young I was told 'Cream Rises To The Top', I think a better expression would be 'Scum Floats' in these cases. Genuinely, how do these people get such jobs?

A lot of them have worked for the Post Office for years - products of the system and process/attitude in the organisation.

[adrianw]

Indeed, but based on the people interviewed in the Horizon enquiry it pays well. When I was young I was told 'Cream Rises To The Top', I think a better expression would be 'Scum Floats' in these cases. Genuinely, how do these people get such jobs?

I was always taught that in large organisations people rise to their level of incompetence

[Saint-Just]

I was always taught that in large organisations people rise to their level of incompetence

You realise you’re saying this to Peter, don’t you?

[Griswold]

I was always taught that in large organisations people rise to their level of incompetence

You realise you’re saying this to Peter, don’t you?

It’s a matter of principle