Reply With QuoteApart from Payne and Strauss!Originally Posted by Jimmcb
Ireland really do indeed. And interestingly they're doing it without players who found residency gets international player status.
Apart from Payne and Strauss!
Really? England are routinely picked on by some of the top-rated referees, and nobody's ever noticed?
Poor discipline and bottling decisions under pressure looks more like the cause of this particular embarrassment...
Well done Ireland and Scotland - tough opponents but bonus points in the end.
It was an amazing atmosphere last night, still recovering from the game. Gutted, but Wales deserved it.
True but they are only 2/15 whereas some of the other countries have nearly 50% of 'guests'.
But then who cares: it's been a great tournament so far and much better than we all envisaged.
It's been a great tournament and the group is still wide open. What better way for England to redeem themselves than stick it to the Aussies.
I'm Welsh and thoroughly enjoyed last night but I'll be rooting for England against Australia.
It has been great so far - for me, seeing the minnows keep the big teams down to more respectable scores is really promising. As I said before, teams losing by over 100 points does nobody any good. If they could sort out the rest time properly next time, we could see a more upsets on the cards.
I wouldn't really begrudge some of the developing teams having a few imports, hopefully it leads to the home grown players improving as a result. Plus it gave us that incredible Japan v SA match!
Edit: that said, there's a Pacific Islander playing in Ireland who could eventually qualify for Ireland, and he currently qualifies for both NZ or Samoa - but he's hedging his bets to see what his best option is. I hate that carry on, and hope he never gets an Irish cap. I don't think I'm totally against the residency rule, but that's just taking the piss.
Was a little underwhelmed with Ireland today - there's just such a big gulf between Sexton and anybody else we have, and I don't like it when our team's success relies so heavily on one player. Bowe's first try was a great finish but the entire backline just drifted across the pitch, and any half decent team would have shut down that space very quickly.
Last edited by Eoin; 27th September 2015 at 23:20.
I am still in total shock from the England v Wales match, and it has taken until now for it to sink in. Now I am able to say that the Welsh deserved it because they wanted it more, and for that reason alone it was the right result.
Next week I am going down to the fanzone in Richmond to watch the game against Australia, but if England play like they did against Wales, they will be taken to the cleaners.
I agree with Brian Moore that England set out to not lose rather than to win. They seemed intent to try and defend their lead rather than extend it, and once you start doing that you're going to give away more penalties in your own half.
I certainly don't think its all over for England.
They know how to beat the Aussies, surely they will perform better against them than they did against Wales.
Wales, MUST beat Fiji (preferably with a bonus point then Im happy).Then against Australia, the result may not matter .
IF however Wales don't get a bonus point against Fiji or god forbid lose....AND England beat the Aussies they are through, (no way will Uruguay beat England..I.M.H.O. of course).......so for Wales the Fiji game is huge as is England V Australia..................Ive managed to book the day off on Thursday, to watch the game (on T.V. unfortunately!).
Im not at all sure Wales will still get through.......yet..(I will feel a lot better on Thursday night though!!)..apart from their injuries...Fiji will be determined to get at least one "scalp"!
Most compelling review yet of England's performance against Wales
http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/sport/...20150928102387
Sorry you seem to know very little about English Rugby, however please be assured that LOTS OF PEOPLE DO NOTICE.
http://www.theweek.co.uk/rugby/52001...-england-wales
http://www.therugbysite.com/blog/new...-walsh-s-hands
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rug...al-to-IRB.html
So for example did YOU notice how on Saturday night, the Welsh only have one straight throw at the line out and that was won by England?? Don't believe me, watch the replay. But for some reason they were not penalized? Also how were Wales about to go offside twice in the final 20, without having a player sent to the bin?? People do notice these things. Now do not get me wrong, I thought Wales on balance deserved the win, but as a fan of Rugby (and England) I just want to see consistency.
As for Scotland and Ireland, they beat teams ranked 16th and 17th respectively. Whoopee
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
Sorry you seem to know very little about English Rugby, however please be assured that LOTS OF PEOPLE DO NOTICE.
http://www.theweek.co.uk/rugby/52001...-england-wales
http://www.therugbysite.com/blog/new...-walsh-s-hands
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rug...al-to-IRB.html
So for example did YOU notice how on Saturday night, the Welsh only have one straight throw at the line out and that was won by England?? Don't believe me, watch the replay. But for some reason they were not penalized? Also how were Wales about to go offside twice in the final 20, without having a player sent to the bin?? People do notice these things. Now do not get me wrong, I thought Wales on balance deserved the win, but as a fan of Rugby (and England) I just want to see consistency.
As for Scotland and Ireland, they beat teams ranked 16th and 17th respectively. Whoopee
Seriously! I assume you're fishing for a bite here as you seem to be implying that there were no unpunished infringements on the part of England during the game.
I do, however, understand that it's always the ref's fault when you lose (I'm Welsh, we invented the excuse)
jeff
They're all about Steve Walsh. He's retired. And unless he is a master of disguise wasn't anywhere near Twickeham on Saturday...
Fair play - at least England lost to the team ranked 2nd.As for Scotland and Ireland, they beat teams ranked 16th and 17th respectively. Whoopee
I do hope England beat Aus though - the tournament needs them to stay in it really
Exactly the points I was making loudly and angrily to my unfortunate better half. She's Irish and had a cracking weekend...Sorry you seem to know very little about English Rugby, however please be assured that LOTS OF PEOPLE DO NOTICE.
http://www.theweek.co.uk/rugby/52001...-england-wales
http://www.therugbysite.com/blog/new...-walsh-s-hands
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rug...al-to-IRB.html
So for example did YOU notice how on Saturday night, the Welsh only have one straight throw at the line out and that was won by England?? Don't believe me, watch the replay. But for some reason they were not penalized? Also how were Wales about to go offside twice in the final 20, without having a player sent to the bin?? People do notice these things. Now do not get me wrong, I thought Wales on balance deserved the win, but as a fan of Rugby (and England) I just want to see consistency.
As for Scotland and Ireland, they beat teams ranked 16th and 17th respectively. Whoopee
A couple of pics from yesterday. Electric atmosphere! Can you spot the Romanian fans.
So let's get this straight, Wales only won because of 'wonky' line outs and all the referee's enjoy a bit of Welsh rare bit ? That line of argument is reminiscent of the school playground excuses you reeled off after your favourite team were beaten at the weekend.Sorry you seem to know very little about English Rugby, however please be assured that LOTS OF PEOPLE DO NOTICE.
So for example did YOU notice how on Saturday night, the Welsh only have one straight throw at the line out and that was won by England?? Don't believe me, watch the replay. But for some reason they were not penalized? Also how were Wales about to go offside twice in the final 20, without having a player sent to the bin?? People do notice these things. Now do not get me wrong, I thought Wales on balance deserved the win, but as a fan of Rugby (and England) I just want to see consistency.
As for Scotland and Ireland, they beat teams ranked 16th and 17th respectively. Whoopee
England were in control of the game for 60 mins, then imploded. They only have themselves to blame and right up to the final seconds they still could have tied or won the game. Simply put, it was England's decision making and execution of plays at critical moments which led to their defeat. Wales, nor any referee can be blamed for that.
Last edited by zippy; 28th September 2015 at 21:21.
Absolutely!
It looks like Burgess is being dropped against Australia, with either Barritt and Joseph or Barritt and Ford at centre, and Farrell at 10. I think he may have been better suited to this game with his experience there, although personally I think it was too early for him to be in the squad.
Barritt and Joseph for me. Although Barritt had a fairly poor game against Wales. They'll need his experience/organisation against the Aussie backs - who look very very sharp. I know they need to be positive but I think if England go all out to just to trade punches with the Aussies in a really open game they'll probably come off second best.
Yep, it was waaaay too early for Burgess. He was exposed badly by Wales in defence, and is still mostly a crash ball merchant in attack. Wales are too streetwise for that to be very effective against them.
England need a favour from Fiji tomorrow.
Brad Barritt needs a better game than he had last Saturday, that's for sure.
I have to say I noticed the number of not straight Welsh lineouts. Also having watched the replay this evening the penalty awarded to win the game seemed unjust. Brown took the high ball and was at no point released by the tackler to give him time to play the ball.
Again in this isn't the reason England lost as that was purely down to the fact the Welsh played their hearts out but a lack of reffering consistency didn't go unnoticed!
I must be the only person that thinks dropping Burgess is a mistake. Barrit offers far less potential and just as much if not more weakness in his game.
I think partnered with Joseph or Slade he offers a great deal.
As an aside what's the point in taking a player like Slade to the World Cup if you are then going to claim he's too inexperienced to play!
Thank you
for those of you who think England lost because England imploded are partly correct, however what caused the implosion was insufficient possession, in part caused by an inability to compete at the line out, they also lost it at the breakdown - to slow, but also penalised for every infringement.
Cause and effect!
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
Burgess isn't the guy for Aus. Too naive defensively I think.
Andy's mention of the breakdown is apposite too. England need a proper 7 - badly. Aus could field Pockock and Hooper together. I think that would be even worse for England at the breakdown. They're quick in mind and body. Which Wood and Robshaw aren't...
Part of the issue with Wales was bench vs starters. Garland put many of his "weakest" forwards on to start (Francis/Lee, Davis/Charteris, Lydiate/Tipuric). The power and inventiveness of that bench if they're still in it with 20mins to go is massive.
As a proper "glass half empty" Welshman I expect Fiji to turn us over tomorrow, just so we can grasp defeat from the jaws of victory...
England need to swallow their pride and pick Steffon Armitage. He's a quality player - he looks absolutely immovable when he's got his hands on the ball in the ruck.
Even no 4 try bonus point could make a big difference. Australia have already missed out, but England haven't.
So, if all 3 top teams lost 1 and won 1 against each other (and presuming each team got a losing bonus point), I think that would have England finishing first, and Australia 2nd by nature of the head-to-head result against Wales?
That's what Im worried about!
Wales need a bonus point win tomorrow..........................
Not going to be easy at all!
saying that...............if that happens, and we get a point against the Aussies too..........Im very happy!
I'll tell you what, as somewhat of a neutral, this pool is absolutely compelling stuff. So many permutations - Fiji are mathematically still in contention... It'd feel quite strange if England v Uruguay turns out to be a meaningless match, but for some reason I think this will go down to the wire.
Scotland v Samoa is probably the only other match which might decide who goes through to the QFs - every other pool is really just about who finishes first and second. Of course, that's me being a bit arrogant and assuming Ireland will beat Italy on the weekend.
I'm dreading the Australia game now. Apart from Wales, there can't be any other team who would have more incentive to put England out of the groups stages of the tournament in their own stadium.
Fortunately, England now have no alternative than to go out and attack, and if they can achieve that they'll limit the penalty count in their own half which has often cost them games in the past.
Aus have picked Pocock & Hooper again - that could be key. It's a strong side - mostly the one that won the Rugby Championship. Cheika's a good coach tactically too. It'll be tough
I think Australia have toughened up in the scrum too, which was an area where we could generally dominate in the past. I hope I'm wrong, but I think Lancaster will be remembered as naive for excluding two of our best players in Hartley and Armitage, and then taking a complete gamble on the novice Burgess.
COME ON WALES!!!!!!!!!!!
I couldn't agree more! Entertaining start but a bit worried about our scrum.
Phew!
No bonus point though - that was tough. Some tired-looking Welshmen out there. I thought the short break was going to see us crumble there for a minute.
Wales don't appear to have a scrum at all. Speaking as an old lock - the scrummaging's a disgrace!
After about 60 minutes (prob have the time wrong) it seemed that Fiji were running though Wales at will. I was hoping for a big upset with so few points in it at the time!!!
Well it's another win, but far from convincing!
Our scrum is still looking shaky. In fairness Fiji gave Eng and Oz a hard time in that department too. Simply put, if we don't fix it then we won't be going too much further.
The good thing is that destiny is in our own hands now. No matter how this weekend unfolds, a win against Oz means we're through. There's a good 9 days or so to re-charge now which we badly need. We looked drained at times today.
Hats off to Fiji. They've played every game with spirit and enterprise despite being royally shafted by the fixtures!
jeff
Think Fiji suffered from the quick turnaround. Cracking running rugby though, if only Nadolo and Matawalu would have been avaliable. Biggar is a very solid 10 though really kept his cool.
France Canada was highly entertaining. Really enjoying some of the second tier no fear rugby!
I'd say Australia in particular are very relieved to see no bonus point win there.
So, if England beat Australia, and Australia beat Wales, I wonder will that be the first time that a team has not progressed to the QFs having only lost one match. To think France reached the final having lost 2 pool games...
I can definitely see England beating Australia - it's knockout rugby at this stage, and Australia have not really been tested yet.
Canada made France work for their win - I'll be glad to see as few cricket scores as possible.
Well the lack of a bonus point has certainly shaken things up, however I would still prefer to be in Wales position rather than knowing I have to beat Australia.
However as I said . If England are not good enough to beat The Aussies then we are not good enough to win the Championship. England need to play the game like it is the final.
All very exciting.
Whoever does not know how to hit the nail on the head should be asked not to hit it at all.
Friedrich Nietzsche
The Wales v Fiji game was excellent! One of the best so far, a friend of mine was playing no.8 for Fiji so had added desire for them to win, some excellent defense and counter attack from the Fijians and boy can some of them shift!
As for Saturday, I've got tickets to Twickers and don't reckon I will have any fingernails left, not sure semi 1 and the Final will be quite so enjoyable to go to if we aren't in it!
It's going to take a herculean effort from our lads to win on Saturday, i'm certainly not optimistic!
Enjoyed Wales vs Fiji yesterday , I think fiji can be pretty happy with how they've played in this
championship, they certainly haven't been embarrassed by anyone and they've played 3 big teams.
That said they do wind me up with some of their silly handling errors / decisions and lack of discipline!!
especially when your cheering them on hoping they will beat the welsh :D
France are so hot and cold, will be interesting to see if they step up when they play the irish, that could
be a great game!
Fiji were superb second half however Wales should have been out of sight in first half, butchered so many chances on the try line. Let them off after the England game, they looked pretty knackered after first 30 mins
Two fantastic games yesterday, and Goneva's try has to be the best so far.
NZ not exactly setting the world alight tonight... Fair play to Georgia - the 33 points difference flattered NZ if anything.
I'm nervous already!! It going to be a long day..
They weren't great were they! Some of the handling errors and turn overs were a bit cringe worthy, still, they got their bonus points within what, was it
22 mins? and they've booked their place in the quarters, not that it was within doubt!
Today should be a great day of rugby! I'm really looking forward to South Africa vs Scotland, if the jocks turn up it could be a excellent game.
No idea how Samoa vs Japan will turn out!
Lastly I've just put some money on Australia to win the worldcup, that way if they beat us tonight then go on to lift the trophy I'll have a modicum of consolation!
Stay positive! England will win!
I HOPE!
Indeed! Just getting ready and heading in shortly, watching the two games pre match somewhere in Twickers so had better pace myself!
For one day only I will let myself say.....
COME ON AUSTRALIA!
Ooh, I feel dirty now! <shudder>
Would love it if we beat them (not happening) and they spank you next week!
Really apprehensive about tonight. Can't really afford to not be dominant at the scrum as Poite will decide early who is in charge and penalise accordingly. Hope all the discussion from Australia about Marler won't be the focus, and that we aren't isolated in contact as Hooper and Pocock are two of the best breakdown players in world rugby.
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