If you have a service case will that not also affect the value if you ever come to sell?Originally Posted by P9MES
I wouldn't like it I would have no option but to let them do it as no AD is allowed to service a 16520. I would probably sell it on after the service.
In this day of internet coverage, I cannot really see Rolex trying to con anyone. You have to remember that 4000ft needs a lot of water proofing and there is no way on Gods earth that they will repair it unless it can take the full 4000ft pressure.
That's better for the resale value...
Sometimes I think most Rolexes go to people who are more interested in the return on investment and not in watches.
Good to read some people actually (professionally) dive using a Seadweller!
Oh my word, a contender for pseuds corner in Private Eye.
It's a bloody watch!. The deepest any human has ever dived in the open sea is 534 metres and it took 8 days to compress and 18 days to decompress.
If numbers impress you, get a G Shock Frogman someone tested this to 1000 metres and it was working just fine, no doubt it would have been fine at deeper depths as well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54CmxcME1a0
No expensive service bills on this I reckon.
A Watchuseek member tested just an ordinary Casio 100m sports watch down to 3370 metres and it was water tight and working. Mind you on this one a crack appeared in the LCD past 1000 metres. Still it wasn't a G Shock.
Mitch
Be aware Rolex will probably flag the case replacement against their records.
It will almost certainly.flag.at any.point it hits the Rolex network in the future.
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Need a service case or not, £3k is madness
I think I would do exactly the same.
Chop it in to WF, unserviced. Put the funds towards something else
Mine was serviced at Kings Hill too. No complaints.
Started out with nothing. Still have most of it left.
No, it won't.
Imagine if car servicing has the same approach and insisted on putting the car and engine back to factory condition at each service and it was just considered the cost of ownership?
Happened to the client of an AD I know well. Watch was flagged and picked.up on 2 separate occasions elsewhere.Sent from my Pixel 4 using TZ-UK mobile app
I think they might expect the brakes to perform as originally intended?
Flagged as changed or not? What difference to value would a new service case make ? Sorry for dumb question as I don’t follow prices that closely I just enjoy my watches. If insurance pay I’m tempted to go for a full monty service and enjoy it for another 12 years. If it has an new case might as well have a new insert and clasp
Thanks for the support and pms. It’s times like this that one really appreciates the expert TZ community
Mike
Significant (-30%).
And make it difficult to sell in the event you need the funds elsewhere.
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Just received the estimate from Rolex via my AD for the service to my ‘07 16610...
Only want the standard service, it began to lose a few secs per day and the overall condition is IMHO 8/10 ( the AD also commented on the excellent condition of the case, bracelet and bezel )
So you can imagine not only mine but the ADs shock at the estimate of £2865!
Apparently along with the £550 service they recommend £2250 for a new case, £65 new bezel!
The AD was actually quite apologetic and a tad embarrassed and we both agreed I think the standard service will suffice.
What I don't get with this 'case change' business is that Rolex will apparently happily not change the case and not test the watch to its specified depth, but still service it? That doesn't sound like Rolex behaviour at all as I would imagine them just refusing to touch it unless you had the required work done. And if it isn't required, why suggest a new case in the first place?
None of it adds up unless Rolex are genuinely trying to stiff customers to the tune of £3k every service,
In the OP's case they claim the case is dented, which might affect the HEV, but even then.
In my opinion there's enough anecdotal evidence here to raise serious questions about professional integrity.
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It's almost like Rolex are saying "Hey, swings and roundabouts, we know you've made a killing on the other models we sold you"
How would a service case reduce the value by 30%? Surely you’d get all the paperwork which would show all the work done to the watch? - it’s a genuine Rolex part, doesn’t make sense to me (although tbh the Rolex world often doesn’t!)
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Good point. Not convinced by the 30%. if someone offered me a 16600 with 2 years warranty just serviced with new case, clasp and insert if I got it at 10% below market I'd bite their hand off, but thats just me!
So here is a new one for you. If I get the case replaced do I get the old one back ? I'm guessing no. Views?
M
Definitely not.
Cheers..
Jase
I’d say 20-30% isn’t going to far off. 10%, not even close.
The watch is probably worth more, noted on Rolex, but with the original case.
I still can’t understand what can’t be sorted with a case in 95%+ plus of issues - obviously with the volumes they can’t be bothered in the UK anymore, but I’d want a second opinion.
It's just a matter of time...
is this difference just for the WIS' on here ? Surely Joe Public on Watchfinder would see it as a benefit?
No one in the know would see it as a benefit. In the same way you wouldn’t pay more for a car with a replacement engine, even though logic would suggest it’s better.
What the uninformed on WF might pay, I have no idea. Why not ask for a price for a recased watch from WF, and compare against a standard watch.
It's just a matter of time...
I'd have thought it depends on the age of the watch. If you change the case on an older model with the serial number engraved on the case, then it's going to have a new serial number (I'm sure I read somewhere that service cases for these older models have a series of unique serial numbers identifying them as service) so the papers won't tie up with the number on the watch. Hence the effect on value.
On the modern Rolex with the serial number engraved on the rehaut, Short of Rolex themselves telling you it's a non original case, there would be no way to tell. One case looks just like another. Bit like bracelets. If it's got the right code numbers on, you have no idea whether it's original or not.
Are you saying they engrave new case numbers on blank cases to match the original warranty cards now?
It's just a matter of time...
I'm pretty sure not. I think they do things on an "exchange" basis.
Flagged as requiring a new case.
In his situation it was not an issue for his insurance policy. But.It.may become one if he tries to.sell it at some.point
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I’d pay more for a car with new engine fitted by main dealer with warranty over one with 100,000 miles on the clock.
No. I'm saying that it used to be that service cases were stamped with a unique number within a range that make them identifiable as service cases. Whether Rolex still do this to watches that originally had serial numbers stamped on the case, I don't know, as all the threads I can find on this are years old. I also don't know whether a service replacement for a modern case that doesn't have a serial number on it is marked in some way to show that it is not the original case.
We need someone like Haywood to tell us what happens now.
Often what’s on a Rolex service estimate is optional
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I think with Rolex it's about completeness,like Porsche.
I had a Lotus that had a brand new replacement chassis by Lotus ,they mark them LR before the vin.Even though it was new , done by Lotus and probably better than other chassis out there, it still impacted on resale.And dare I say feel to the car ownership once I had found out
It would still be very interesting to see photos of what Rolex classifies as requiring a new case when the OP didn't recall †he damage.
I’m expecting a picture from service tomorrow
M
You've made me very nervous now I’ve got 2 of these due to send for service they’ve been worn every day for 16-17 years and are certainly showing the signs of that.
Edit to say I bought one for my dad and myself not both worn by me daily lol
Yes but the car with the new engine would be worth less on the classic market. Originality is key (just like vintage Rolexes).
Either recased or left as is w/o full water resistance, the value’s already been lost here.
Answering various points made in the this thread:
Service replacement cases are typically very easy to identify.
I would expect easily to sell such a watch as a 16600 with a replacement case (though not a "more vintage" piece) with full disclosure at no more than 10% discount from the price of a watch which had its original case. Our "bubble" of hard-line watch forum views would be completely alien to the majority of the public with better things to do.
Sometimes Rolex will agree to service work with a disclaimer that they do not guarantee water resistance.
If such a watch were in the hands of many in the trade, they would service it through independents or put it through auction where it would of course achieve a price from bidders ignorant of Rolex's wish to replace the case. However, had it been returned from Rolex with the work not done there would typically be a "work declined" coding inside the case-back. Yet another reason, anyway, why we should laugh at daft bidders paying more for watches at auction without warranty than they could pay for better watches from dealers, with a warranty.
As I said earlier in the thread, it is my clear impression and that of others that Rolex UK's service department appears, shall we say, to be finding a lot more work that needs doing these days.
As for professionalism etc, my eyes were opened by a staggering incident recently.
I had sent a 16610LV for service and a new bezel insert.
It returned with the work done, but a badly scratched bezel insert.
Rolex UK said that this watch could not have left them like that as their Quality Control would not have allowed it. Rather, they said, it simply must have happened when we opened it. They would fit another --- but at my cost.
I refused and told them that we had video of the parcel being opened and the scratch immediately evident.
They must have thought I was bluffing, maintained that the insert could not have left them with a scratch, and said that they would need to see the video.
No doubt to their surprise and some middle-management bum-clenching embarrassment, I sent them the video.
They rang and said that they now accepted my version of events. No meaningful apology for the bad job, the failed quality control, doubting my word (it's not as if we're unknown to them) and forcing me to go to the trouble of downloading and copying them CCTV footage.
I referred them to their previous comments and misplaced certainty that their QC would not have allowed such a damaged job to be packed and dispatched.
"In every other, recent case," I argued, "where you have rejected a client's claim that a watch was marked or damaged upon receipt, will you now reconsider whether your confidence in the Quality Control function was entirely misplaced? Will you now revisit those cases and consider reimbursing those clients who may have been charged to correct your own mistakes that you wouldn't acknowledge?" They would not comment.
For me, this was a disgusting disservice that poisoned a relationship with the brand I have always championed and whose products' virtues I still extol daily.
It's not for me to quote main agents here, but it is fair to say that many are increasingly unhappy with their lot and for a number of reasons. Service costs and "required work" are on the list. They cannot win; ask for jobs to be returned undone and it's apparently a black mark against watch allocations! Consider the Hugh Grant "Love Actually" press conference scene with the American President, as comparison may be valid.
There are some great individuals at Rolex UK, largely from the Henry Hudson era. Some observers may feel that they are overwhelmed, sadly, by a strange corporate hubris led by others.
Nothing ever stays the same. I will hope that things get better from here.
Last edited by Haywood_Milton; 2nd March 2020 at 11:24.
Excellent that you did that (and indeed that there is hereby some modest publicity for that episode). That is exactly the issue - that virtually no one else would have recourse to that sort of proof. One can only hope that it resonated around QC, anyway ...
I'm beginning to think the last place I'd want to send my Rolex for servicing is Rolex. Owning a Rolex these days seems like a bit of a liability. Next to no availability, almost indistinguishable fakes, service cost gouging, and in real terms they're no better than a lot of other, much cheaper watches.
Which brings me to the question: Where do I send my 16610 for a service if I can't send it to Rolex for fear of it coming back a totally different watch and being charged the price of a new Omega for the privilege?
Duncan at Genesis would be my recommendation.
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A few years ago I took my 16610LV into Rolex in St James for a routine service. I got the call that it was ready after about 6 weeks, and as I worked nearby I popped in to pick it up. It looked like new, and the white coated lady set the date and time and wound the watch as I paid my £480 or thereabouts for the service. On arriving home I was shocked to find, as I unscrewed the crown just to check it all worked ok, that the crown stem was either bent or there was some other major issue - as on each revolution of the crown it jammed then freed up very noticeably. How the ‘technician’ who set the watch didn’t notice I have absolutely no idea. I took it back, waited another fortnight or so and it came back sorted (with no additional charge as you’d expect) but their ‘legendary servicing’ was clearly anything but that on this occasion. Imho they are no better than any other watch company in this regard, they just charge you more. I’m not convinced by their white coated receptionists either, always thought they were watchmakers but not sure now!
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My Kermit probably needs a service as it's not been in 10 years (though keeping time fine). Will have a look here as I can see Rolex getting sniffy about any marks on the bezel/hands/dial - not that there are any but this thread has given me the heeby geebies
Food for thought, for sure Rolex don't seem as trustworthy as they were. I would take it mine to a Phantom Rolex Centre now.
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Ok dummy alert but I have to ask, what is a Phantom Rolex Centre?
An independent watch service centre, not called Rolex any longer...or a well known chap or chapess who specializes in Rolex...
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As an interested party, who would you recommend for a Seadweller service?
I've never had a Rolex, so I can't answer that, hoping to change that soon, It appears Rolex themselves wouldn't be my first choice if I could find someone else to carry out servicing
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