We were out with friends back in July and parked in this small shopping centre in a Disabled bay which my wife does have a badge. Parking is free for three hours but we did run over by 15mins. We went away for a week when I got back there was a letter from Enterprise Car Hire stating they had charged £35 to my credit card for providing information to Euro Car Parks regards excess parking time, (We were in a hire car that night).
I have waited for them to contact me regards the fine, which incidentally I was ready to pay, nothing was heard and I could not contact them as I had no information of the offence. Fast forward to today I received a demand for £170 for non payment of fine. I tried to telephone ECP but there is no way to speak to anyone, tried the appeal route as soon as I put the charge no in it throws it out and states this is with our debt recovery company.
I then ring up and get through to someone at the debt recovery who sympathised with me but said there is nothing she could but offer a discount if paid today £130. She said they sent a letter on the 1st of September which I genuinely did not receive, so it’s my word against theirs, surely it should be sent signed for. I paid simply to avoid escalation to higher fees as there is just no way you can contact these faceless mongrels. I feel I want to do more but what.
Well done on getting your frustration out here on the forum, hopefully the process has been somewhat therapeutic. These things are absolutely infuriating and you've probably done the right thing to put it behind you.
In the past I've let these things fester, and then I annoy my loved ones because I'm stressed by the whole mess.
Parking is hateful!
I sympathise with your issues but I have to admit the thread title did make me laugh. I haven't heard the term Mongrels since I lived in Sydney in the late 80's
These legalised thieves are operating all over the country. If you park anywhere, check for signs and cameras. One local to me is Wells by the Sea Car Park and a Google ( or Youtube) search will give you access to literally hundreds of people who have been caught by this scheme (/scam)! Some have not had the correct change and took too long to get a parking ticket. Some saw the (allegedly high) charges and left (again taking too long after queuing for the machine). Buyer beware, whether you buy or not!
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.9572...7i13312!8i6656
£4.50 per "Day rate Only"!
https://www.google.com/maps/@52.9574...7i13312!8i6656
So don't just enter, find out the price to collect your fish and chips from over the road and leave, or you could have had a three courser at Galton Blackiston's restaurant for the same price!!!
Last edited by tixntox; 12th October 2022 at 15:38.
Have I understood it correctly?
You hired a car and the hirer has then charged your card for providing your information to the car park provider so that the car park provider can fine you, following which the car park provider did not contact you but now expect you to pay another £170 for the privilege?
Stuff that!
Offer to pay the original fine or let them take you to the small claims court. The parking fine is just an invoice after all, so if they have not invoiced you then how can they expect you to pay it?!
I am sure they will try all the tricks in the book to get you to pay up, but their way of dealing with things is just ridiculous.
^ Bit late for that, already paid.
I applaud the calmness of your post OP.
Yep, I just noticed that part....Originally Posted by jukeboxs
I feel aggrieved - and it didn't even happen to me!
As I said I have no qualms in paying the original fine as we did go over, but my argument is I never had the chance to. They said they sent me the fine paperwork etc on the 1st of September which is five weeks after the offence, I genuinely did not receive it so how would you get get on arguing that, it’s my word against theirs, as I said they should send the paperwork signed for.
There used to be a site dedicated to fighting against parking charges, but it escapes me what it was called now. Managed to get a ticket for the wife overturned.
Pepipoo..
This might be useful for future reference
They didn't so they have no case. Offer to pay the fixed fee or offer to see them in court. They know they won't win so should relent.
EDIT: Just realised you paid the bigger fee. Barstewards!
I think they bank on it frightening you into paying so you can get it out the way. I am going to speak to Citizens Advice see what they say and if favourable I will chat to a solicitor. My only question I want advice on is the contact from them serving the fine.
[QUOTE=hilly10;6082364She said they sent a letter on the 1st of September which I genuinely did not receive, so it’s my word against theirs, surely it should be sent signed for.[/QUOTE]
My understanding is that there is no requirement in UK law for documentation to be sent Signed For. The courts regard the UK postal service as sufficiently reliable - hence documentation like NIPs, V5s, etc are sent by normal post.
If it comes to a "he said, she said" discussion, my guess is that the courts would accept the word of a reputable[*] organisation that they had posted it. They might be able to back that up by showing that other documentation they had sent has been received by the intended recipients.
[*] For some value of "reputable".
Pepipoo, as mentioned above, is your best bet. There's also a sub-forum on Money Saving Expert dedicated to assisting people with parking disputes. But please, please, please don't refer to it as a "fine" - a private company cannot issue a fine.
This is extremely timely as my parents have just been through this with Euro Car Parks and their low life collection agencies. Long story but again they also never received any initial documentation until the matter reached a collection agency. In this instance my Dad did actually complain and got the fine/charge reduced to the original amount (something like 60 quid).
Sadly they got another PCN the following week after which they ignored thinking it was a duplicate (and yes I told my parents off this this). After much frustrating back and forth and disorganisation, they eventually paid the second fine which had gone up to 170 by this point. Only reason we couldn’t get this one knocked back to the original amount is genuine cock ups and ignorance by my parents.
Point is that ECP appear to be shady as hell, but it’s always worth challenging the greater fine/charge amount where the original PCN with lower charge has been ‘lost in the post’.
I am not a solicitor and genuinely not wishing to put a dampener on things but from what I recall when studying certain aspects of contract law quite a few years ago, if an organisation can provide proof of postage for what they say they’ve done then that constitutes their part of the contractual process.
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Staying 15 mins over does not equate to the loss of £130. It should be say one hour parking charge plus a small admin charge at most.
With peppipoo (however you spell it!), they like the whole truth and nothing but the truth, preferably in one go to enable clear and quick guidance.
I hope you get back the money paid.
It’s all about who you complain to, there are no telephone numbers, emails just get sent back with we cannot comment or respond as this case is with out debt collection company. I really hate this company now with a passion and really feel the need to get some recompense for my own satisfaction, but how
Was the first letter sent to the hire company by mistake?
If they have done this you might be able to claim some money back.
Enterprise will have a record of it if they did.
What a pain. I’ve just googled them to lodge their trading style in my brain so I can avoid them if at all possible (and I note the top of the menu is not who we are or where we are but “pay parking charge”).
To be fair that information is headlined on their home page: -
“Euro Car Parks is internationally renowned for its first class parking services, instantly recognisable and highly respected brand, outstanding customer service and market leading expertise…”
Customer service is non-existent and majority of their car parks in Birmingham are waste ground that they manage for the owners. Shit house company
Outstanding in the negative sense then.
Sickening. Parking is getting worse and worse. Most places here want you to download an app, create an account, upload a card. So I’ve got about ten apps. Much rather just pay cash money or tap card.
Read up on the law - Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, Schedule 4 (paras 13 and 14 relate to Hire Cars). There are a number of requirements placed on the parking and hire companies relating to documents & timings. If they are not met, they do not have a claim. Check also the hire agreement - if you appeal successfully, many hire companies will refund the admin charges.
I've only really come across three common apps...PayByPhone, RingGo and Apcoa Connect (plus Just Park if you want to park on someones driveway). No messing around trying to find change. No problems where you could end up getting a ticket if the sticker fell off your window or dashboard. When you are late back to the car a bit like the OP (although not blue badge), press one button and extend your parking. Plus an instantly accessible audit trail of your parking payments if ever there is a dispute.
Last edited by Christian; 14th October 2022 at 15:56.
One wonders how scrupulous they are about doing this? They hand out parking charge notices and then the driver has to challenge.
Friend got a charge for staying just over 3 hours in an ASDA car park. I looked on Google streetview and the signs said the limit was 4 hours.
I had 2 PCNs in the same hire car on the same day, but challenged both successfully as they hadn't supplied all the documentation stipulated in POFA. Unfortunately I suspect its just easiest for the hire companies to forward the hirer's details to the parking co. and claim their admin fee than check the details...
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